The following article may contain affiliate links or sponsored content. This doesn’t cost you anything, and shopping or using our affiliate partners is a way to support our mission. I will never work with a brand or showcase a product that I don’t personally use or believe in.

If you’ve followed Tori for any length of time, you’ve seen this face, and probably know her name, too –– Tori’s wonderful BFF and forever #friendmoon travel partner, Kristine Ota.

As we finish up season one of Financial Feminist, we wanted to take a minute to let someone close to Tori interview her, and who better than the woman who knows her best.

In this episode, they share laughs and tears over memories from their past four years of friendship. They talk about the heartache and big wins of 2020, share stories of trips, including a particularly embarrassing evening in the UK where Tori may or may not have made out with a complete stranger. You’ll have to listen to find out.

Because this episode is quintessential Tori and Kristine, they also share plenty of inside jokes and pop culture references –– don’t worry, everything you need to keep up is in the resources below.

It’s a bittersweet final episode of season one, and we just wanted to say again how grateful we are for each and every one of you who has listened to, rated, reviewed, subscribed to, and shared the Financial Feminist podcast.

But, just because season one is over doesn’t mean you can’t still support the Financial Feminist.

Keep sharing this podcast, especially with the women in your life who need to hear it. The information we shared in season one is evergreen. Heck, you can even come back to listen when you need a pick-me-up or just a reminder of how much power you already have.

Not sure where to start with your finances? Take the free Money Personality Quiz to get tailored resources for your financial journey.

Kristine’s Links:
Instagram
TikTok

Pop Culture References (in order of appearance):
13:00 CMBYN (or FMBAT)

21:38

John Mulaney – New in Town

John Mulaney – Kid Gorgeous

John Mulaney – The Comeback Kid

43:21
Sage & Stone (the song that made me cry on #friendmoon2020)

Perks of Being a Wallflower – Tunnel Scene

55:30

Pasta Casalinga

1:04:45

My Dream House

1:06:45

Biz Insider : I road-tripped through Southern Italy and lingered over high tea in London for about $2,000 — here’s how I did it

1:16:47

Parks & Rec, Monalisa Sapperstein (6:45 for the reference)

1:17:24

Anderson Paak & Bruno Mars – Leave the Door Open

Transcript

Tori Dunlap:

Hi, team. Welcome back to Financial Feminist. I’m Tori Dunlap, money speaker and educator, founder of Her First $100K and the unofficial Try Guys archivist. We are at the end of season one, so it is bonus episode time y’all. It’s the episode you always hoped for, but never knew you needed. My best friend Christine interviews me. When I started the show, I knew that I wanted to make at least one episode per season that wasn’t about money. And because it’s my podcast, I get to do what I want. So we’re not really talking about money this time around. If that’s not for you, go ahead and skip this episode. No harm, no foul. But if you’re interested in being a fly on the wall today while we shoot the for like two hours, great, strap in.

Tori Dunlap:

In this episode, we share laughs and tears over memories from our past four years of friendship. We talk about the heartache and big wins of 2020. We share stories of our trips, #friendmoon, including a particularly embarrassing evening in the UK where I may or may not have made out with a complete stranger. But you’ll have to listen to find out. You quickly realize how off I drop pop culture references and quote my favorite things. So today’s show notes are a little bit different. In addition to resources, more info about the show and Christine, I’ll also have time codes with links to all the references and inside jokes we make in case you want to follow along. I am basing this off of, anybody have the Gilmore Girls DVD box sets and they had a guide to all the references they make? That’s the inspiration for this. So if you care, amazing, check out the show notes. And please, if you love the show, rate in review, subscribe, tell your friends, we appreciate your support of our mission and this movement. Let’s get into it.

Tori Dunlap:

For the best friend.

Kristine:

Best friend.

Tori Dunlap:

You’re the best friend.

Kristine:

How you doing?

Tori Dunlap:

I’m good. I’ve been listening to the 2005 Justin Timberlake classic, Future Sex Love Sounds.

Kristine:

Is that the Sexy Back one?

Tori Dunlap:

Yeah. That album does not get enough credit. It starts with a full, very clear sexual, just right into it. It’s very clear what he wants immediately.

Kristine:

It makes it sound like talking about like, there is no foreplay, it’s right into sex. There is no warmup.

Tori Dunlap:

He does say, “Tell me which way you like that.” And we like consent, we like discussion and communication. No, but the song is immediate. It starts with Future Sex Love Sounds. That’s the first song on the album. And then it transitions immediately into Sexy Back. And it is one of the best transitions and we don’t give it enough credit. It’s so good. If that came on in a club, I would lose my goddamn mind.

Kristine:

I’m like future sex, does that just mean pre-planned?

Tori Dunlap:

Well, foreplay, I guess, maybe. We’re going to have sex in the future, and there’s going to be sounds.

Kristine:

And then you’ll play this album. When we have it in the future.

Tori Dunlap:

In my head, love sounds was like what happens during sex, but your interpretation’s probably more accurate than just like guttural moans.

Kristine:

Justin, we have 13 tracks of you just moaning. And you’re like, “Oh my God, I swear it’s going to be longer.”

Tori Dunlap:

Oh, and Timbaland’s like, “Yes, yes. Keep that, keep that.” And he’s just in there, “Yeah. Just go ahead and …” Or it was actually really funny. There’s this old interview he did on Ellen, again back in like 2005, where he talked about how the song Sexy Back came to be. And you definitely know that those lyrics were written after the music was, because it’s just like, “Come here, girl. Go ahead, be gone. Come to the back. Go ahead, be gone.” It’s just go ahead be gone with it’s for like a solid 45 seconds, every minute, two minutes.

Kristine:

Oh, that’s got to be pretty cool to be able to go into a studio and be like, “I’m just going to say a few words. Can put it into any track.”

Tori Dunlap:

And it will be a hit that Tori Dunlap loses her mind to at sixth grade dances.

Kristine:

And as a 26 year old woman.

Tori Dunlap:

Kristine. Hi, tell me who you’re and what you do and what you’re all about.

Kristine:

Hi, everyone. Welcome to the Financial Feminist podcast. I’ll be your host today. My name’s Kristine Ota. And you’re probably wondering, did an infant break into a studio and hit record? No, it’s just me, Tori’s best friend and co-creator of friend moon. Copyright pending.

Tori Dunlap:

I actually should contact my attorney. Anyway, keep going.

Kristine:

Oh, really?

Tori Dunlap:

Yeah, I should. Why not? I don’t know if anybody’s copyrighted friend moon or trademarked it.

Kristine:

Oh my God. If we can get 10 cents every time somebody says friend moon.

Tori Dunlap:

Every hashtag we hunt them down and we’re like, “This is a misuse of IP. Take it the fuck down.”

Kristine:

And every year we can have one really delicious meal from what we get from our cut.

Tori Dunlap:

On friend moon. We’re like our friend moon was sponsored by the friend moon trademark.

Kristine:

In this bonus episode, I’ll be taking over as host. While unlike previous episodes where Tori is interviewing guests, I’ll be interviewing Tori about all things not finance related.

Tori Dunlap:

You want to kick it off? Or we can vamp for as long as we want. We were joking back and forth on text last night that this is just literally going to be a conversation that’s normal between her and I, and it’s going to be five hours long.

Kristine:

Right. And also too, trying to be cognizant that maybe our conversation would be 80% inside jokes and maybe 20% people might understand. So I’m going to try and do the flip flop of only doing. First is how we met.

Tori Dunlap:

What’s the question?

Kristine:

I have a feeling that people are going to want to know how we met. [inaudible 00:06:05]

Tori Dunlap:

That’s a good question. No, we get asked that a lot. So Kristine and I met at work. It was my first job out of school. Kristine had been there for what, two years? Three years at that time?

Kristine:

Yeah. Two years.

Tori Dunlap:

That sound about right? Yeah. Yeah. We were just coworkers, and I thought she was super fashionable. Still is, of course, very fashionable. And she was kind of honestly the cool kid in the office.

Kristine:

What?

Tori Dunlap:

You were. You were. You would roll in at like 9:45 and just be like, “What’s up? What’s up bitches?” And I’d be there at like 8:15 and you’d show up at 9:45 looking always very put together. And yeah, I was 21, 22, and my first job out of school. And the company environment was super social and it was very focused on people getting to know each other and hanging out outside of work. And yeah, we just became friends that way. But we weren’t very close when I asked her to go on a trip. I literally walked up to her desk, I found this crazy flight deal to Costa Rica, we had maybe known each other for six months at that time. I don’t know if I had every spent time with you alone outside of work, to be honest, at that point.

Kristine:

Oh yeah, that’s true.

Tori Dunlap:

We would hang out after work, but it would always be with other coworkers. I don’t think we had ever actually done something independently. So I asked you to go on this trip with me, and honestly, that could have been a horrible choice. That could have been [crosstalk 00:07:56].

Kristine:

Was I the first person you asked?

Tori Dunlap:

We didn’t know each other. Yes.

Kristine:

That has to say something too.

Tori Dunlap:

Well, it might have been my boyfriend at the time, but he was in law school and he was not going to be able to travel, it was after his Spring Break. So it might have been Aaron. I don’t know, and as cheesy as it sounds, I literally think something told me, “Go ask Kristine.” To be honest, I think it was also the practicality of, “She’s right up the stairs, I wonder if she’ll travel with me.” I want to go, but I don’t want to go on this thing alone. And it was also just I think something inside was like, “Go ask Kristine.” And yeah, we had never really hung out outside of work, so it could have been absolutely disastrous. Not only could we not have gotten along, but we were literally going to travel internationally together for a week plus, and that could have been so bad. And the crazy thing is, you accepted. You were like, “Sure.” And we bought tickets like a half hour later.

Kristine:

That day. Yeah.

Tori Dunlap:

Yeah. Can I tell the story about Travis?

Kristine:

Oh, my god. Okay.

Tori Dunlap:

So Kristine also happens to work with her ex partner, which I admire her for so much, because that’s really tricky. And I ended up going to him, and we had a meeting, him and I, and I think he had heard or maybe I brought it up that I was going to travel with you. And he was like, “You don’t even know each other.” And he wasn’t wrong. He was like, “You don’t even know each other. Why are you doing this?” And I think he was a little jealous, but also just like this makes no sense. He was very judgemental immediately. He’s like, “Why are you traveling?” I was like, “I don’t know, I think it’d be fun.”That was the weird thing, is no part of me was really worried. I was like, we’re going to have a good time.

Kristine:

It’s Costa Rica, baby.

Tori Dunlap:

Yeah. Well, it’s a Testament to like how we felt about each other. Because that could have been so bad, like so bad in terms of either safety or in terms of like even interests, you could have been interested in completely different things than me. And then that was the first friend moon that was friend moon 2017. We went to Costa Rica and we had an amazing time. The weird thing about a lot of our friend moons is that the first day there was a thunderstorm that happened in 2019 too, and so we were driving through Costa Rica to get to our first Airbnb, which was on the side of a Costa Rican cliff. And it was this crazy, nothing I’ve ever experienced before, because we were in the rainforest, so it was thunder so loud and just crazy lightning. That was our first day.

Kristine:

You could hear the monkeys just going off.

Tori Dunlap:

Oh, the monkeys. Ooh-ooh-ahh-ahh. It was crazy. It was so crazy.

Kristine:

We were in a Rainforest Cafe, is where we were. I was waiting for jalapeno poppers
.

Tori Dunlap:

I ordered a $22 burger that was this big, and a little strawberry lemonade. No. And it was a great trip. We had these amazing Airbnbs. That first one was this beautiful private pool for like a hundred bucks a night that we split. The second one had horses. Didn’t it have horses?

Kristine:

Yeah.

Tori Dunlap:

But I think we forget about that a lot. It had horses and another private pool. And that one had air conditioning, which was really nice. And then we swam in a waterfall our last day. That was completely spontaneous and literally was hard to believe we were there. We ate really good food. Yeah, it was a good time.

Kristine:

We had breakfast with baby sloths.

Tori Dunlap:

Oh my god. How did I forget the sloths? Yes, that was one of our planned activities was we were like, “We are going to get breakfast with baby sloths,” where they are on the opposite side of the table eating their hibiscus flowers for breakfast and we are eating our scrambled eggs and watermelon on our side of the table, and literally got to watch them be fed. And it was this amazing animal rescue rehabilitation clinic, so there was all of these animals that had injuries or weren’t doing well and could come and stay here. And it was so cool, we got a tour for like 50 bucks a piece.

Kristine:

Yeah, 50 bucks with breakfast with sloths. It was great.

Tori Dunlap:

I know. And it was a donation to this nonprofit. And we went zip lining. Yeah, it was a great time, and that ended up being friend moon 2017. We should probably explain what friend moons are too.

Kristine:

Right, copyright pending.

Tori Dunlap:

That’s like me going up to Armie Hammer and trying to explain to him what friend moons are. Oh, so I can’t just dorp an Armie Hammer reference and not also say that we do not condone his recent activities or the activities that have come to light? I met him in March of 2020 right before the pandemic hit because I saw him in a play and one of our favorite movies, which we’ll probably talk about, is Call Me By Your Name.

Kristine:

CMBYN.

Tori Dunlap:

So I had a fucking freak out. CMBYN, otherwise known as FMBAT, fuck me by act two, also a reference. We’re literally going to have to do a glossary. But yeah, and I had to explain to him what a friend moon was because I realized of course he didn’t know. I was trying to tell him how much the movie meant to us on friend moon, and he was like, “Friend moon?” And I was like, “Oh, god, of course you don’t know.” So it’s basically a honeymoon type trip that you and I take as best friends. So we basically spend however long eating really good food and traveling all over and telling each other how much we love each other as platonic best friends.

Kristine:

I feel like it works so well because the things that we like about traveling are the same. So whatever activities or excursions or food that we go and get, it’s like okay we know that we’ll be cooking from the Airbnb for two meals of the day, and then we’ll go out and eat or we’ll splurge on one meal for that trip, or something like that.

Tori Dunlap:

Well, and I think we get that question a lot too, of how do you know who to travel with or how do you figure that out? And for us, we’ve dated people that we don’t travel with as well as we travel with each other. I think the biggest thing is food is the priority when we’re on trips. It’s basically can we eat our way through the city? And so you have to find, not only common interests with somebody, but common interests when you travel. Because I love museums, I’m a big museum fan, but when I travel, I’ll go to a museum or two. Like one of my previous partners, it was like museums 24/7. And that was fun, but that was probably not my choice. That was not the thing necessarily that I would like to do. Was it awful? No. But am I wanting to go to a museum every single day, sometimes twice a day? No. No. Not at all.

Kristine:

And I think museums are very much curated to, I don’t know, it doesn’t feel very authentic.

Tori Dunlap:

Straight white men, potentially?

Kristine:

Yeah, or I’m just thinking about British museums where it is basically whatever country that they colonized, and a lot of their artifacts are based on that. Anyway. So I’m really glad that we don’t do museums that much. And honestly, what I feel like I learn in museums is not nearly as much as I would just exploring.

Tori Dunlap:

Eating the food and talking to people.

Kristine:

Mm-hmm (affirmative).

Tori Dunlap:

Yep. Agreed. I do love a good museum. Especially we’re planning, hopefully, fingers crossed, we make it to France. We have a plan to go to France in September, and hopefully COVID pending we’re able to go to France. I love the museums of Paris, like Musée de l’Orangerie.

Kristine:

Pompidou.

Tori Dunlap:

Musée d’Orsay. The Louvre is cool to go to, but it’s –

Kristine:

It’s huge.

Tori Dunlap:

I felt so overwhelmed. Oh, I felt to overwhelmed. I literally spent 45 minutes in the Louvre. I saw Mona Lisa and I was like, “Okay, there’s too many people. I need to go somewhere else.” It was too much.

Kristine:

Yeah. I basically sped walked through the Louvre when I went, and I’m like, “Okay, that’s famous, that’s famous, that’s famous.” But I feel like with a lot of things with art, it’s based on the history of what was going on in that time, and a lot of times I’m like, “I don’t really know too much.”

Tori Dunlap:

Right. I want to go back to the Louvre and do a Beyonce tour of the Louvre, like all of the shots from …

Kristine:

And then it’s going to be you posing and then me taking the picture.

Tori Dunlap:

Yes, I’m glad you know it. That is the other thing, and this is going to sound ridiculous and very hashtag influencery, but we take each other’s photos all the time. That’s something that is important to both of us because we want dope photos. And so we don’t even have to tell each other anymore, I just hand her the phone or she hands me the phone and it’s like this unspoken rule of photos are going to happen.

Kristine:

Minimum 20 photos will be taken of each of us.

Tori Dunlap:

Oh yeah. Yeah. You’re not just taking one or two, you’re taking 20 from five different angles. And then we don’t also have to explain to each other if we just want to pull over on the side of the road and look at something. That’s the other cool part. I remember one time on a hike, I was going through a really hard time, and I was just like, “I need to get out of the car and just dance it the fuck out.” And I didn’t need to explain anything to you, I just turned on Boy by Charlie Puth, which is one of my all time favorite songs, and just pulled over on the side of the road. And no, “Tori, what are you doing?” You just got out of the car and danced with me, it was fantastic. It was great.

Kristine:

Aww. I thought you were going to say when we were driving through Italy and we pulled over and we picked some flowers or something, or sage was growing on the side.

Tori Dunlap:

Oh, we did do that. I forget about that sometimes. Yeah, tell that story because that was really fun.

Kristine:

I feel like I just told it. Anyway, we pulled over to the side of the road and Tori –

Tori Dunlap:

In my head it was this beautiful day and we were driving across Italy and we were on this road, we didn’t see another person for like 20, 25 minutes, we were just driving and then there was these beautiful flowers on the side. And now I’m telling the story. But go ahead.

Kristine:

I think it was in, oh gosh, I forgot now what the name of those houses were called. The Trulli houses.

Tori Dunlap:

Trulli, is that how you pronounce it? Yeah. We’ll link a photo in the show notes, they’re the coolest fucking looking houses, they’re so cool.

Kristine:

Mm-hmm (affirmative). And we were driving through the Italian country and all of a sudden Tori was like, “Oh my god, these flowers are beautiful, let’s pull over.” So we pull over, pick some flowers, there’s also wild sage on the side of the road too, and we picked that. And then Tori stuck it in the vents in our car so it would smell really nice in our car. And then it dried.

Tori Dunlap:

It smelled like sage in the rental car. And then it dried and it went everywhere. Every time we turned the AC on it was like, all right, sage in the face.

Kristine:

Sage dust.

Tori Dunlap:

Yeah, it was on the way to Matera. And then oh my god, trying to fit out car in that garage in Amalfi.

Kristine:

Oh my gosh, I completely forgot about that.

Tori Dunlap:

Trying to navigate with the German couple. So we drove from the Bari area, which is East, Southeast Italy, so the Amalfi Coast, which is, what is that, West, Southwest-ish. It’s not fully south, it’s not into the full boot. But the funny thing was is we were literally staying on the Amalfi Coast, on the the side of a cliff. So we had, not an SUV, but my RAV4 equivalent. Still an SUV, but a more compact SUV. And they had this tiny little parking garage that we were trying to pull our car into, and then this other couple was also staying there and they had this little tiny car. So we had to play Tetris with our cars for the four days we were staying there, it was really funny. Three days?

Kristine:

And their lock was a stick.

Tori Dunlap:

Oh god, I forgot.

Kristine:

The lock to the garage was a stick that you had to put in where a lock would be.

Tori Dunlap:

In to make sure the garage door wouldn’t open and shut. Yeah, it was just a stick thrown in there to make sure it would come apart. It was very funny.

Kristine:

And that was a good deal too. That was like 80 bucks a night or something.

Tori Dunlap:

Oh, yeah. And if you guys follow me on Instagram, you’ve probably seen the bathtub shot with this beautiful bathtub with stone in the back, and that was that Airbnb that we just randomly found.

Kristine:

Yeah, and if you just opened up the windows, you just see the coast, and then there was a little lemon tree.

Tori Dunlap:

Yeah, a lemon tree, it was so pretty.

Kristine:

So beautiful.

Tori Dunlap:

Yeah, it was a great time.

Kristine:

So yeah, I think that’s friend moon.

Tori Dunlap:

25 minutes later, that’s friend moon. That’s how we met.

Kristine:

That’s fine. [crosstalk 00:21:09].

Tori Dunlap:

No, that’s how we met, that was the original question.

Kristine:

Well, I was actually thinking about this yesterday when I was coming up with questions, was the first trip that actually I inv
ited you on, but then you said no. But we really didn’t know each other for very long. All I knew was that you loved John Mulaney.

Tori Dunlap:

I regret this so much, but please keep going, it’s just going to be really painful to hear again. Go ahead.

Kristine:

I had an extra ticket to go see John Mulaney in Spokane, Washington. So I was like, “Well, I know Tori loves John Mulaney.” And so I invited her, and she’s like, “No, we don’t really … Where are we going to stay?” I’m like, “I don’t know, we’re just getting an Airbnb.”

Tori Dunlap:

Well, and you were also going with friends. I feel like especially when I was a little younger, I was always nervous to go somewhere with a group of people, because you don’t know what that group of people’s going to be into, and especially not potentially having a way to get back home, if you don’t want to be there anymore. If you go to a party and you’re like, “I don’t like the vibe,” you can just leave. Versus if you’re five hours away from home, it’s a little tricker. But the kicker was it wasn’t just going to see John Mulaney, it was going to see John Mulaney in a bar where he was testing material. And I’m haunted by saying no still.

Kristine:

I think that was the tour that he was testing material for, New Kid in Town? [crosstalk 00:22:47]

Tori Dunlap:

You mean New in Town? New in Town, Come Back Kid, Kid Gorgeous. It was probably Kid Gorgeous. Was it the catholic bit?

Kristine:

Kid Gorgeous, yeah.

Tori Dunlap:

The bread of God is bread. He will bring us bread.

Kristine:

I think so. Did he tell a story?

Tori Dunlap:

Only one from Jericho will bring bread.

Kristine:

[crosstalk 00:23:14] start talking now. [inaudible 00:23:16] going to continue singing. I know that much about our friendship where I’m like I’m going to lay it out.

Tori Dunlap:

Wait it out. Wait it out.

Kristine:

Tori needs to get all of this song out.

Tori Dunlap:

I really want to do the rest of the bit. If we weren’t recording, I would do the rest of the bit. No. Was it that bit?

Kristine:

The only joke that I really remember is the one where he talks about his sitcom that he did. Did he talk about that one?

Tori Dunlap:

Oh, that material never went in any specials, so maybe he tested it and never [inaudible 00:23:49] So you know something about him that I don’t. It’s fine.

Kristine:

Which it makes sense because it’s talking about specific [crosstalk 00:24:00] in it.

Tori Dunlap:

Oh, yeah. That makes a lot of sense.

PART 1 OF 4 ENDS [00:24:04]

Tori Dunlap:

That makes a lot of sense.

Kristine:

Well, he talks about I think he was doing something for ESPN or something and he was in the same room as Michael Vick. That hadn’t happened yet, I think. The story hadn’t broke yet I think about the dog-

Tori Dunlap:

Weird.

Kristine:

[crosstalk 00:24:21]. Anyway. And so John Mulaney gets a phone call from his agent that says, congratulations basically. Your sitcom is picked up and he was so excited. And then Michael Vick turns to him and he like, “This is going to be the best thing that ever happened to you.” And he goes, “Now I see that as maybe an omen, a bad omen to the sitcom.”

Tori Dunlap:

And to the people listening who don’t know, the sitcom Mulaney was around for one season and we all agree it’s bad. Even Mulaney is like, this was not great. I had a vision of what it would be and it was not that. It was not good. It was not good at all.

Kristine:

But he comes out with really great material. Just watch the Lunch-

Tori Dunlap:

Sack Lunch Bunch. So I think, I mean, I love that story. Obviously, I love John Mulaney in anything he does ever and I think that it’s a cool Testament to you can do something, have it absolutely blow up in your face and still be good at what you do. You can try something, fail and still do other things. Your career is not over. Granted he is a straight White man, which I think helps a lot, but he did something, tried it and it didn’t work. And he’s like, okay. I’m going to do something else. I’m going to continue doing standup. I’m going to host the Independent Spirit Awards with Nick Kroll. I’m going-

Kristine:

Twice.

Tori Dunlap:

Yeah. I’m going to have a kid special that I sell to Netflix. I’m going to do a guest.

Kristine:

Going to win. Was it? They won Tony’s.

Tori Dunlap:

They did not win Tony’s, but it was very celebrated when they were on Broadway, which is how I met John Mulaney, which was a big day.

Kristine:

Was that the first time or they only time you’ve met him?

Tori Dunlap:

That was the only time. I had a connection.

Kristine:

Oh, that’s right.

Tori Dunlap:

I’m very proud of myself. When I’m in front of the person that I’m excited to see I am excited, but I’m pretty, I’m good be
cause I’m like, I can’t let them know I have no chill. And then as soon as they’re gone, as soon as they walk down the street or as soon as they turn I am literally bawling. Immediately. This happened with Drake Bell, this happened with Armie Hammer, this happened with John Mulaney and it will happen someday with Timothee Chalamet. So I’m really proud that at least in the moment because I’m like, I can’t have you see me as crazy. I have to go be crazy privately after.

Kristine:

I don’t know whether I feel like I’m charismatic, but I like to think that I am. And I bet the celebrity just kind of who’s that person that is giving you really weird eyes?

Tori Dunlap:

Who’s she?

Kristine:

That being said, I think I did say some pretty cool stuff to Andy Roddick.

Tori Dunlap:

You did not.

Kristine:

Did I tell you about this?

Tori Dunlap:

That’s such a deep cut, Andy Roddick.

Kristine:

Yeah. That also just, I guess, shows that age difference. He hadn’t won a Wimbledon yet.

Tori Dunlap:

And for those listening, he is a tennis player and he is also married to Brooklyn Decker, which is honestly his greatest achievement. Let’s be honest, marrying her-

Kristine:

Maybe 10 months later he started dating Mandy Moore from One Iceland.

Tori Dunlap:

Oh, I didn’t know they dated.

Kristine:

Yeah. When he won was it well older or U.S. Open, but she was there and they kissed instantly-

Tori Dunlap:

Oh, interesting.

Kristine:

…and stuff, but that’s crazy. I won a free trip to Paris when-

Tori Dunlap:

I forgot about this. Yes.

Kristine:

… I was 15 years old.

Tori Dunlap:

Didn’t you meet him at a bar?

Kristine:

So if anybody is from the Houston area there is a furniture sales named Mattress Mack and you might have also heard of him as well. Well, first his tagline is Gallery Furniture Saves You Money. His whole thing is like Gallery Furniture Saves You Money. Wow. And he does a lot of philanthropic work.

Kristine:

He actually opens whenever there’s some natural disaster or, for instance, what was happening in Texas with the freeze, he’d open up his store and lets anybody sleep there and then he has a kitchen and then serves everybody food. But one of the things that he did was he gave 150 students, high school students, a free trip to Paris to go see the Davis Cup and I won one of those trips and he rented out the hard rock Paris. And I was dancing because I fucking can. Did I say that?>

Tori Dunlap:

Yeah. We’re cursing all over on this post, with the guest.

Kristine:

So I was dancing. I was in my head and I was-

Tori Dunlap:

It’s like a TikTok where it’s like how I think I look versus how I actually look. I’m a boy lightning, thunder. I’m a girl that’s going to make you wonder.

Kristine:

Wonder.

Tori Dunlap:

And who’s been?

Kristine:

That’s exactly what happened and all of a sudden this guy is in front of me and starts dancing and rubs his butt on me and I’m feeling it. And then he leaves, turns his head and it was Andy Roddick. And I was like, oh-

Tori Dunlap:

To a 15 year old.

Kristine:

…cool. Was dancing with Andy Roddick. And then later on that night as he was leaving I got a picture with him and then whispered in his ear, I didn’t know why guys could dance. And then he just laughed hysterically and left.

Tori Dunlap:

I didn’t know you were that smooth, Kristine, oh my God.

Kristine:

I am pretty smooth when I try to be and I have enough drinks in me except not when I was 15.

Tori Dunlap:

No, I only think of the good lines 10 minutes after. Actually-

Kristine:

Just run that.

Tori Dunlap:

…on the way when I was passing Armie Hammer to leave I tapped him on the shoulder and I was like, say hi to Timmy for me. Completely I was not [inaudible 00:30:14] and completely normal, whatever, say hi to Timmy for me. And I turned and I’m like and then Chris Rock walked right past me. Did I ever tell you that?

Kristine:

Oh, really?

Tori Dunlap:

Coming out of the theater after everybody had left.

Kristine:

And then you said, tell Armie to tell Timmy I said hi.

Tori Dunlap:

No. I was with two friends and I kept thinking, this is going to be honest, I felt so bad. I knew he was in an animated movie. I could not think of it. And I was like, oh my God, it’s Moshoe. And I was like, fuck no, that’s Eddie Murphy. And then I was like, oh my God donkey. And I was like, no, that’s Eddie Murphy. And it took me walking three blocks in New York before I realized it was Madagascar that I
was thinking and I don’t know what Chris Rock has been in the lot of things, but in my head it was just kids movies. It was like, what kid’s movie do I know him from? Madagascar.

Kristine:

Yeah. And in Anamorphic.

Tori Dunlap:

Zebra. Isn’t he a zebra?

Kristine:

I think so.

Tori Dunlap:

Why does nobody talk the fact that Zootopia is basically Madagascar?

Kristine:

I still have not seen Zootopia.

Tori Dunlap:

Oh, it’s so good.

Kristine:

But I do feel like I have seen it. I feel like I have seen it based on you would tell me.

Tori Dunlap:

Well, the trailer is just the perfect thing because it’s the DMV scene. And whenever I feel really sad I watch that to cheer me. I never not laugh. It’s so funny.

Kristine:

Well, that’s actually one of my questions was when you’re feeling down what do you do to cheer yourself up?

Tori Dunlap:

Oh, that’s a nice question. These last six months have been really hard actually. And, of course, you know this, but the listeners might not. On the outside our business has been killing it. Everything looks great. I’ve gone through a lot of personal growth and change in the last six months. I think everybody has in the pandemic and in quarantine.

Tori Dunlap:

But I had a really rough period and in October, November of last year of 2020 and I was always trying to find things to make me feel better because to be honest I wasn’t feeling so great for a good chunk of time. I think on a normal day it’s watching a try guys video. Probably if I’m not feeling great I’ll watch a try guys video. They’ve saved me in quarantine. I’ll just put on videos I’ve seen already 12 times just in the background to hear noise or to hear voices.

Kristine:

I only knew about the try guys through Facebook will throw that video on, throw try guys videos on me without me asking for it.

Tori Dunlap:

I don’t know how I discovered them, but it was was two years ago and then I just binged every video they had and I was like, oh my God, these are really fantastic. And they’re just fantastic, really strategic with how they run their business. And the way they’ve laid their business out it’s almost like breadcrumbs for me to follow in building my own business. But try guys videos. Ocean’s 11 has been go-to quarantine movie. I have watched Ocean’s 11 probably seven or eight times during quarantine. I love Ocean’s 11 so much. It’s the perfect movie for me because it’s not heavy, but it’s still really good.

Kristine:

Who do you think you would play if you were an actress?

Tori Dunlap:

Oh, I’d want to be like a rusty Brad Pitt character. I don’t think I want to lead it because I don’t want that amount of responsibility or risk, but I’d be the second person in charge.

Kristine:

I think he was the one that kind of organized the team. He was this-

Tori Dunlap:

Yeah. Kind of which would make perfect sense. I would be like, oh, we need a Saul and we need the Mormon brothers, the Mormon twins and we need Bernie Mac. But I probably-

Kristine:

Be the contortionist.

Tori Dunlap:

I know. I was going to say because they call it, they’re like, hey, what was it? Five foot Chinese man. Where are we going to get a five foot man to foot in the thing? What would would you be in a-

Kristine:

So this was actually one of the questions that I had then I started thinking about it and I would love to be the hacker even though I don’t know how to hack. Just because I want to be able to talk like hackers do in movies. Do you know what I’m talking about?

Tori Dunlap:

Yeah.

Kristine:

Where they’re like-

Tori Dunlap:

No, I know exactly what you’re talking about.

Kristine:

Oh, I’m going to go in the front door. Oh, is that locked? I’m going to just swing around the back. Oh, that’s locked. But then I’ll lift up the mat and there’s a key there.

Tori Dunlap:

Perfect, heist over. You don’t need me anymore. It’s a heist.

Kristine:

They’re like, Kristine, you haven’t hacked anything. You’re just telling me how you get into it.

Tori Dunlap:

You’re just slapping your hands on a keyboard. You take your cat’s paws like a cat’s paw and just go around.

Kristine:

I’m just talking about how to get into a house.

Tori Dunlap:

Yeah. You’re Riley from National Treasure. Who’s the best character? Bar none.

Kristine:

Yeah. I feel like all the characters that play as hackers are pretty fun. They’re always usually the center of entertainment.

Tori Dunlap:

They’re the comic relief. They’re nerdy, but not too nerdy. They’re always nerdy enough, but they’re still also hot, cute. Perfect example. The new James Bond, he’s super hot, but he is hot and he pushes up glasses and tells you about quantum mechanics or quantum. I’ll take a cue over bond every single day to be honest. We all think we want James Bond, but he is a terrible human being. He would not be my boyfriend.

Kristine</strong >:

Yeah. Hands down.

Tori Dunlap:

He’s 100% my type. That’s sounds great.

Kristine:

I actually have, well, it’s so funny that we just keep on hitting these questions that I ask. There’s actually kind of talking about quarantine leads into this which was, what’s one of the biggest lessons you learned?

Tori Dunlap:

In quarantine?

Kristine:

Disgusting.

Tori Dunlap:

Oh God.

Kristine:

And then second part, the biggest thing that you learned about yourself.

Tori Dunlap:

You know this question is going to make me cry and I feel like you did it on purpose, but that’s okay. I learned how resilient I am and I think I knew that, but not to the full extent. And I also learned self reliance and not in the independent, I don’t need anybody, fuck you away, but just I am really good at taking care of other people. And this year has been really focused on trying to make sure I take care of myself too. This year has been hard obviously for everybody.

Tori Dunlap:

And it’s been interesting for me because I’ve had obviously these very public successes, which has been fantastic and exactly what I dreamed about and wanted. And it’s also I’ve tried to figure out how much to share now that I do have the amount of people in the community that I do.

Tori Dunlap:

And so a lot of stuff that happens is stuff I’m not going to talk about because it’s something that’s private to me and something that I’m working through, but it’s a really good reminder to everybody that a lot of what you’re seeing publicly, I’m not making shit up. I’m so excited to be achieving these milestones and I’m so excited to be growing the team and I’m so excited to do all these things. And also it’s been a hard year. Personally, it’s been a really hard year.

Kristine:

I’m so proud of you especially business aside, but personally one of the things I’ve been thinking about you a lot especially when we first went into quarantine and being like, oh man, that’s got to be so hard to be living by yourself. Especially someone like you who’s such a people person and will always be like, all right, Kristine, when am I going to see next?

Tori Dunlap:

What are we doing?

Kristine:

As I’m leaving you’re like, okay, great, when am I seeing next?

Tori Dunlap:

And I think that that’s the interesting thing about quarantine is I’m so thankful to live alone that I don’t… I love my parents very, very dearly, but I think we could all say my parents and I that if I lived with my parents, oh God. So there’s a lot of people who are living with their families and that’s great for a lot of reasons and also terrible for a lot of reasons. I love living alone. It’s great. It’s fantastic. It’s also very lonely. Especially in quarantine it’s been very lonely.

Tori Dunlap:

And then just a lot of processing of just accepting things that happen that don’t make sense. And I am very good at building the life that I want. I’m very good at it. I’m very good at saying, I want this thing, here is the path I need to take in order to get it. I give an example of being on good board in America. It’s like, I will pitch this person and I will connect with this person, and I’ll set myself up in this way that eventually that can be a reality, and it was.

Tori Dunlap:

But there’s bigger things in life especially relationships and just the forest from the trees, it’s zooming way out things that you really don’t have any control over and that you can’t strategically plan for. And that actually if you strategically plan for them, or try to control them, or try to make them happen when it’s maybe not the right time for them to happen, it makes it so much worse. And that’s been a really hard lesson to learn.

Tori Dunlap:

And it’s something that I’m still processing and working through of how do I balance going out and getting what I want versus understanding that there’s some things I just have to wait for. I have to strengthen myself and allow myself to be that the best I can be for when those opportunities do come, but I can’t chase them and I can’t want them really badly.

Kristine:

I mean, you can want them but-

Tori Dunlap:

Yeah. It’s the realization. I think a lot of times we think we know what’s best for us, we think we know what’s best for ourselves and you have to be open to the possibility that what you think you want is not actually what’s supposed to happen. And even if that feels so shitty in the moment, and even if that feels like you’re derailed or it’s trusting as we wait the sounds that the universe is going to work out and that things are going to work out the way it’s supposed to if that feels really shitty.

Tori Dunlap:

And we’re learning that in the pandemic. Nobody planned for this. Nobody wanted this, but I hope that when we get out there’s so much that we’ve learned and that we take into life. That we learned to slow down, that we learned to support each other, support our Black and Brown neighbors and people of color, that we learned that seeing our best friends and seeing our partners and seeing our family is something that we shouldn’t take for granted. I just saw we’re recording this after I hit a million followers on TikTok, which is super exciting.

Tori Dunlap:

This was a couple days ago earlier this week and I got to see my friend Karina who I have not seen in a year and a half. We have virtual book club together, we FaceTime, I’ve talked to her, but I haven’t seen her in literally years and not by choice. It’s because of pandemic and just getting to hug her, getting to go outside and eat together is something we take for granted all of the time. Just meeting a friend for a coffee, or being able to go on a walk without a mask. I just hope that we come out of this and I hope for myself too.

Tori Dunlap:

It’s so hard to be in an uncomfortable place because you just want to get out of it, but you just want to get out of it. Now I think I’m doing a vari
ation of the dad’s monologue for Calling by Your Name, but his whole thing he’s like, don’t muscle through it? Don’t force yourself to not feel or force yourself out of the uncomfortability because you’re supposed to be there. And so in October, November where I really wasn’t doing well I would’ve given anything to feel like myself.

Tori Dunlap:

I didn’t know why I was so depressed, and why I was so anxious, and why I was so deeply sad and I wanted out of it so badly and was trying to fix it. And what was so important for me is I needed to sit in it. I needed to be in that because now I can look back and be like, I will get out of it because this will happen again. And what felt like something that I would never get out of, I got out of and I learned a lot from the experience and had to process a lot of stuff. And so don’t feel when you’re uncomfortable and when things are shitty that just have to rush through them in order to feel better because that’s not how you actually feel better.

Kristine:

I saw this on the New York Times Instagram, but I’m quoting somebody that’s basically saying this time made me realize how human we all are. For good at that and realizing that we can’t do anymore than what we are capable of doing and what people-

Tori Dunlap:

And that makes me think, so you and I February 2020 was supposed to be Australia New Zealand and it ended up being a national park road trip because for obvious reasons we couldn’t travel, which was a great compromise. It was a beautiful trip. This is really going to make me cry. This is my favorite memory last year. First day we’re driving and we’re like hour eight or nine of driving that day, the sun is setting and we’re in Montana. We’re in middle of nowhere Montana and the river is flowing next to us.

Tori Dunlap:

And the sun it’s full on golden hour and the song comes on that always has made me kind of emotional, but hit really different at that moment. I remember grabbing your hand and I just started crying. And that was the other great thing is you didn’t ask me why, you didn’t ask if I was okay. You just knew that I had to sit there and cry for a while. I think you did ask, you were like, “Do you want me to drive?” And I’m like, “No, I’m good.”

Kristine:

I still am fully aware that we’re in a moving vehicle.

Tori Dunlap:

And I’m balling my eyes out potentially not being able to see the road. But I remember thinking that I felt completely alive in that moment. And I have had those moments before especially in college, a very perks of being wallflower thing where you’re driving through a tunnel and you’re blasting music and you feel so alive, you feel untouchable. I’ve had feeling alive moments like that. I have never had enough feeling alive moment like the one in Montana because I felt everything. And that’s how I knew I was alive. I felt so joyful and also so deeply sad.

Tori Dunlap:

I felt so optimistic and yet also so pessimistic. It was the full duality of being human. And I was just, again, as cheesy as it sounds, I just sat there in this moment and I’m like, oh, I know I’m alive because of how deeply I feel all of these things. And what a gift that we can feel pain, and joy, and depression, and sadness, and frustration, and also beauty, and love, and hope, and all of those things too. So that was my favorite moment of last year because it was. Oh, we are human. I am alive. I am human. And I know I’m alive. I know I’m human. But because of this human experience of feeling so shitty and also so great at the same time.

Kristine:

Also, to put in the context of when that was Seattle and all of the Pacific Northwest had just gone through really intense wildfires.

Tori Dunlap:

We forget about that. That happened too. We couldn’t breathe, we couldn’t go outside.

Kristine:

The sky looked like an apocalypse. I think we had talked about if somebody were to come out of a coma and just to step outside to see everybody in masks, even inside in masks, what just happened? What year is this? And it was deep red. And so when we went to Montana it was the first time we could just step outside and breathe.

Tori Dunlap:

Yeah. And, I mean, it was like the smell up pine and you could smell the water and it was beautiful normally, but it was also just taking for granted breathing, breathing fresh air and especially without a mask and without smoke and without-

Kristine:

I feel like breathe is the word of the past year and how much we would appreciate that.

Tori Dunlap:

Well, and when you’re in the present moment that’s all you can do. That’s all you have control over is just how you’re existing in that moment. You don’t have control over anything else. You don’t have control over things people say to you, or things people do to you, or situations that happen to you, but you do have control over how you show up to them. And that’s the big thing I realized to encompass 25 minutes into one TLDR.

Tori Dunlap:

That is the thing I realized is it’s rather than doing the work trying to control things I’d rather do the work on myself to give myself all of the tools I need for handling things that come up that I can’t control and reframing it. Because I spend a lot of my time anxiously trying to plan, or control, or protect myself when what I can do is create good habits, create a good mindset to handle whatever happens rather than trying to control it because you won’t be able to control it.

Kristine:

Another thing when I think about breathing is the other day I just let out a really big sigh and then Mary is like, “Oh, is everything okay?” And I go, “I’m just realizing how often I forget to breathe.” And as soon as I do that, I always notice that my shoulders are up to my ears.

Tori Dunlap:

Do you meditate at all? We’ve never really talked about it.

Kristine:

No, but I definitely know that that’s something that I need to be more conscious about. Something that I had wanted to bring up was I had a dream about you last night. It’s not very long the part that I remember, but there were two pianos next to each other-

PART 2 OF 4 ENDS [00:48:04]

Kristine:

I remember, but there were two pianos next to each other and you were playing on both of them. And then yo
u went behind your back and played it behind your back. I’m like, okay, Tori, now you’re showing off. And then-

Tori Dunlap:

Dream Me is hot. How can I become Dream Me? My God.

Kristine:

And then a doctor comes up to us and gives us the COVID vaccine.

Tori Dunlap:

Even better.

Kristine:

But in a Catholic wafer form, so he just… And then you just stuck your mouth out, and he puts the COVID vaccine in your mouth.

Tori Dunlap:

Oh, I like that better. That feels honestly much more natural, as a Catholic for so, so long.

Kristine:

Mm-hmm (affirmative). [crosstalk 00:48:56] I woke up and I was like, this feels so Tori.

Tori Dunlap:

Playing two pianos and also a Catholic reference? Sure. Yeah. [crosstalk 00:49:07].

Kristine:

And I was like, Oh. It’s probably because I’ve been thinking about this podcasting and-

Tori Dunlap:

Probably.

Kristine:

What I’d be asking you. That’s also-

Tori Dunlap:

Did you know you’re supposed to accept communion in a very specific way? Did you know this?

Kristine:

No.

Tori Dunlap:

If you’re Catholic, you know that depending on what hand, if you’re left-handed or right-handed, the hand that… Your dominant hand goes under your other hand. So for me, I’m right-hand dominant, so my right hand goes under my left hand. Then you go up to the priest, the priest puts the communion on your non-dominant hand, and then you take your dominant hand out and pick it up, and then put it in your mouth. It’s a very strategic thing. You can’t just… You could go up with one hand, but that doesn’t really make sense. I guess some people do it, but when they teach you, when you’re getting First Communion, it is dominant hand down so you can come around, basically, and pick up-

Kristine:

Use that.

Tori Dunlap:

The communion, put it in your mouth, and then bless yourself with your dominant hand.

Kristine:

And then somebody who’s ambidextrous is like-

Tori Dunlap:

I know. Well, and actually I lied, because bless yourself… This is a fun thing about Catholicism, too, that technically even if you are left-handed, you are not allowed to bless yourself with your left hand. And one of my best friends, who I’ve known forever growing up, is left-handed, and I’ve actually never told her this, but it would really always bother me, especially as a kid, when she blessed herself with her left hand. Because I got it grilled into me that you only bless yourself with your right hand, even if you are left-hand dominant. You always bless yourself with your right hand. Always, always, always. Maybe they’ve gotten rid of it. Maybe it’s an archaic rule, too, but I was taught that you bless yourself always with your right hand.

Kristine:

Well, isn’t there that saying where it’s like, right hand of the Father Almighty?

Tori Dunlap:

Right.

Kristine:

Something like that.

Tori Dunlap:

Seated at the right hand of the Father. Yeah.

Kristine:

Right.

Tori Dunlap:

Right. Maybe. Maybe that’s it.

Kristine:

I went to a church where these old women would bake bread and that’s what we would use. And they would just pass platters of bread to everybody. So it was really good. I was like, oh, this is great.

Tori Dunlap:

That’s very sweet. I’ve heard of that happening. There’s also some churches that I’ve been to that they get wine from the community, so you bring in a bottle of wine and they bless it, obviously. But sometimes you just get a different wine, or somebody who’s a wine maker would come and bring their bottle of wine. And then it was always trying to figure out, is the wine today red wine or white wine? That was always an interesting-

Kristine:

They serve white wine? I guess I always thought it’d be red because that’s what it’s supposed to represent.

Tori Dunlap:

The color of blood? Yeah.

Kristine:

The blood.

Tori Dunlap:

No, there was sometimes, it was like… At least the couple churches I went to growing up, it was like… I don’t think it was full. It wasn’t Chardonnay white. It was a deeper… Maybe it wasn’t white wine and it was… Because it definitely wasn’t red, but it was kind of almost yellow.

Kristine:

Oh.

Tori Dunlap:

It was like a deep, deep, deep kind of white color.

Kristine:

I was going to say rose.

Tori Dunlap:

I don’t know what kind of wine that would be. No, because it wasn’t pink. I don’t know. And again, I’m 12, so I couldn’t tell you what wine it was. And then when I got my First Communion, I remember we were in second grade and we were all so worried about what the wine would taste like. That was the big drama, would we like the wine? Because you had to get wine on your first go, even if you didn’t like it. You don’t have to get wine ever again if you don’t want to. That’s
a fun Catholic fact. Fun Catholic fact. You don’t have to drink the wine at communion if you don’t want to ever again. My mom wouldn’t take the wine. My dad and I would, as I was growing up. But on your First Communion, you have to take the wine.

Kristine:

Oh my God. And then you’re like, cheers, sweetie.

Tori Dunlap:

Yeah. Cheers, sweetie.

Kristine:

Your second-year-old self.

Tori Dunlap:

Yeah, exactly. No, I remember liking it. I remember taking… Because I took the tiniest little sip possible, and I was like, oh, I want more. I was like, that is good. I would like more, please.

Kristine:

I need to call my girlfriends, and we got to go out for drinks.

Tori Dunlap:

I’ll call my… Yeah, second grade seven-year-olds.

Kristine:

Mm-hmm (affirmative). [crosstalk 00:53:18].

Tori Dunlap:

Hey, what are you later this evening, bitch? Ew. Oh, me in my little white communion dress, my little veil. Yeah.

Kristine:

Oh my God. I guess the next thing was going to ask you a bunch of questions, and you’re going to try and answer relatively quickly.

Tori Dunlap:

Are we doing rapid fire? Oh my gosh. You’ve planned for this. I’m very flattered. All right, I’m ready.

Kristine:

What scares you?

Tori Dunlap:

Eels and death.

Kristine:

What’s your favorite food?

Tori Dunlap:

Fried chicken.

Kristine:

What’s your favorite meal that you ever had?

Tori Dunlap:

A pork tenderloin in Hawaii.

Kristine:

What are you most proud of?

Tori Dunlap:

That’s interesting, because I am super proud of my business. I’m super proud of everything I’ve accomplished. That’s my first question right off the bat. And then I think to myself, I’m like, no, you want to be more than your business. I’m really proud of the person I am and the person I’m becoming.

Kristine:

Mm.

Tori Dunlap:

Cheesy as that fucking sounds, that’s really what I’m proud of. My business is part of that. My confidence is part of that. My friendships are part of that. But yeah, I think ultimately, I’m really proud of… I feel like if eight-year-olds… Speaking to seven, eight-year-old me, if she would’ve met me today, she’d she’d be pretty obsessed, which is always the goal. So, yeah.

Kristine:

As being your friend, and seeing your growth from literally when you came up to me and was like, I have this idea for a blog, and I’m like, okay.

Tori Dunlap:

Four years later, you’re like, cool.

Kristine:

Mm-hmm (affirmative).

Tori Dunlap:

Great, hun. Go do that.

Kristine:

Mm-hmm (affirmative). When you had 2,000 followers on Instagram.

Tori Dunlap:

No, not even. Maybe like 600 at that point.

Kristine:

Yeah.

Tori Dunlap:

Yeah. Crazy.

Kristine:

And then-

Tori Dunlap:

Crazy, crazy, crazy.

Kristine:

And back then, I think it was Victori Media.

Tori Dunlap:

Victori Media, baby.

Kristine:

Mm-hmm (affirmative).

Tori Dunlap:

… if anybody’s here from the Victori Media days, thanks for being here, team.

Kristine:

Yeah.

Tori Dunlap:

Long time ago.

Kristine:

And we’d take pictures when we [inaudible 00:55:06]. And we would literally grab ice cream every day, I think.

Tori Dunlap:

Well, in the summer, yeah. It’d be every other day because yeah, where Christina and I worked, it was a block from Pike Place Market. So we’d walk up to Pike Place Market every day, either to just grab lunch or to go on a walk. And that’s one thing I wish people knew about Seattle, is yes, Pike Place Market is touristy, but I hang out in Pike Place Market still. I love Pike Place Market.

Kristine:

Yeah.

Tori Dunlap:

It’s lovely. It’s really cute.

Kristine:

A lot of really good restaurants. And I would say the restaurants-

Tori Dunlap:

Yeah.

Kristine:

And the food stalls that are not the huge touristy ones, but the ones that you have to go and find.

Tori Dunlap:

Pasta Casalinga, baby. The best. Women-owned. They’re this amazing pasta place in Pike Place Market. Again, I’ll link them in the show notes. If you’re in Seattle or you’re visiting, that’s where you want to get pasta. It’s so good.

Kristine:

Mm-hmm (affirmative).

Tori Dunlap:

They make handmade pasta for, I don’t know, $12, $14 a dish. It’s so good.

Kristine:

Yeah. And when I think we were there, I think it was about $10, but that was four years ago.

Tori Dunlap:

Yeah.

Kristine:

What makes you feel the most confident?

Tori Dunlap:

Honestly, probably doing barre, or getting out of barre and being like, I just fucking did that. Although I’m sweaty and I look like a rat. I was telling… Actually, I was talking on live about this last night, about my relationship with fitness and my body, because for a really long time, I thought working out is supposed to make you skinny. That’s it. Working out’s supposed to make you lose weight. It’s supposed to make you skinny. It’s not for mental health. It’s not for strength. And I think we’re told this as women, you work out in order to maintain your figure, or in order to be the person that society expects you to be, from a body standpoint.

Kristine:

Mm-hmm (affirmative).

Tori Dunlap:

And yeah, again, it’s not sponsored in any way, but Barre3 has honestly changed my life, but definitely changed the way I view working out. I work out now to be stronger. I work out for my mental health. I work out because I like it. I was never that person who craved workouts. And I’d hear somebody say that and I’m like, you’re obnoxious and I hate you. I don’t want to hear you tell me, oh, I crave sweating, and oh, I really want to work… I was like, I’m not that person. I crave sitting on a couch. That’s what I like to do. And I was active. I’d walk and I’d do Zumba class every now and then, but I was not actively working out.

Kristine:

Before, pre-COVID, that was one of my favorite weekly routines that we would do at least once or twice a week.

Tori Dunlap:

Yeah, we do barre a lot together. Yeah, but I think obviously not necessarily feeling confident in the class itself, although sometimes I feel that way. It’s more like how that has helped my confidence overall is just… I remember now being able to go to class and know all of the positions that they’re going to ask me to be in, or knowing when a certain song comes on, it’s probably going to be this certain thing that we’re doing, or activity, and knowing my body can handle it. And then also having the foresight or the awareness to know when my body doesn’t want to do that. When it’s like, no, I don’t feel… Not only I don’t feel like… But this doesn’t feel good. I would not like to do this. And then actually listening rather than doing the push. Hustle. It doesn’t matter. Pain is gain. And it’s like no, I don’t want to feel in pain. I’m okay with growth. I’m okay with uncomfortability. That’s how your body changes. But actual pain is not what you want.

Kristine:

Yeah, yeah. And I don’t think people maybe focus… I think, actually, it’s starting to shift where people are realizing-

Tori Dunlap:

Right.

Kristine:

How important it is to really listen to your body, especially if you are dealing with pain. But last question is, what’s the name of the lipstick that you use? That’s your quintessential lipstick, which-

Tori Dunlap:

Everybody asks me about that.

Kristine:

I’m wearing basically your lipstick color.

Tori Dunlap:

Oh, it’s almost like you planned it. Boom.

Kristine:

I can’t really see it, but-

Tori Dunlap:

Oh, and I almost am, too. It’s more purple, but I got sweats on. You actually dressed up for this and I’m in fucking sweats.

Kristine:

Oh no, these are sweats. These are sweats.

Tori Dunlap:

Oh, are they? You look great. You put on makeup and shit. It is a Sephora lip stain. Not just, you can buy it at Sephora, but it’s actually the Sephora color. It’s called Blackberry Sorbet. I bought it on a whim, loved it, and then built an entire brand around it. Which in hindsight, one of my smartest decisions, because now, no matter what I’m wearing, as long as I’m wearing the lipstick, it looks on-brand. So, no matter what photo I post on Instagram, no matter what photo is on my website, no matter what colors I’m wearing, it still looks cohesive, because that color is in the shot. So I’m really proud of that decision.

Tori Dunlap:

And actually on the big… And you know this, but on one of the big life dream goals is I want that lipstick shade named after Her First $100K. I want it named $100K, or Her First $100K, or if they can’t give me that exact shade, give me the slightest difference and then call it $100K. I want a co-branded lipstick with Sephora.

Kristine:

Hey Sephora.

Tori Dunlap:

I know, hey Sephora, if you say… If you are listening and you are influential at Sephora, hit me up. But yeah, that’s kind of on the big vision board.

Kristine:

Yeah.

Tori Dunlap:

That someday, hopefully-

Kristine:

What is on your vision board?

Tori Dunlap:

That, a TV show. I want a TV show. I want-

Kristine:

Like The Try Guys? Or-

Tori Dunlap:

Kind of. The Try Guys are doing without a recipe, as a TV show. Obviously that’s not a format that I would do. I don’t think I’d sell a show to Food Network, but maybe. I do love the Food Network. Guy Fieri. Hello, love of my life. I think it would be almost like… Hopefully I can announce the book by the time we are live. But basically, if my book was a TV show, let’s talk about all of these different issues, and then let’s give you actionable advice around how you can pay off debt, how you can start investing. Kind of like a documentary, but also a kind of more reality show. Maybe it’s like a makeover show too, where I’m going into people’s homes and I am helping them better their money.

Kristine:

Mm-hmm (affirmative).

Tori Dunlap:

Maybe there’s that, too. So I have a couple different ideas with that. I also want to sell a friend-moon branded trip to Travel and Leisure, or Conde Nast Travel, or somebody that’s big in the space that literally, we just can write about friend-moon. At least for one year, but I’d have to do it every year. Copyright pending.

Tori Dunlap:

Well, I think the thing is… And you and I didn’t really even talk about this today, but society is so focused on traveling with your significant other all the time. There’s Instagram accounts that have millions, if not hundreds of thousands, of followers that are focused on that quintessential skinny blonde girl being held up by her super hot ripped fiance or husband or partner. And I think I’ve internalized that in a lot of ways, and I think a lot of people have. I cannot travel either by myself, or I can’t travel with somebody other than my partner.

Kristine:

Right.

Tori Dunlap:

And of course that leaves out people who either don’t have partners, or like traveling with other people.

Kristine:

Mm-hmm (affirmative).

Tori Dunlap:

So I think one of the things that I just love that we fucking do is that no matter who we’re dating, no matter if we’re dating anybody, we are going on these trips together. And honestly, I have a better time.

Kristine:

Yeah.

Tori Dunlap:

It’s the best. And I just wish we… That was more accepted to travel with your girlfriends, especially from a safety standpoint. Because I get asked that all the time. Do you feel unsafe traveling together? And I can count on one hand, really two fingers, the time we’ve ever felt vaguely unsafe while we’ve been traveling. And it’s also… I just wish that there was more discussion about it, and I really want Travel and Leisure to pay us to do a fucking huge article or series about traveling with your best friend. Because-

Kristine:

Would love that.

Tori Dunlap:

That’s something that’s so underrated.

Kristine:

Yeah. And totally not tapped. I don’t think people realize… When you think even excursions, or things like that, it’s like very much focused, I think, on a couple standpoint, or deals. Hotel deals will be for-

Tori Dunlap:

Romantic couples or… And if they do cater to friends, it’s only for bachelorette parties, which is in service to a wedding, right? And we talk more about solo travel, which I think is so important too. I do love traveling by myself, and I’m starting to do more and more of that. And I think that has seen an uptick because people aren’t willing to wait for somebody else, which I love. But there’s still this gap between either travel with a partner, you can travel by yourself. Yay. But there’s hardly ever discussion, truly, I think, about going on international trips, traveling with your best girlfriend, and having the kind of experiences you would have with a partner, but with your best friend.

Kristine:

Right. And I think that’s something that I’ve learned a lot as I get older, is all of these things that society tells you that this is the thing that you have to do, you don’t have to do that. Or whatever’s being marketed to you. You don’t have to do that.

Tori Dunlap:

Christine and I joke a lot that we’re just going to buy a house together, and then just have separate quarters in the house or stuff like… We joke about that all the time. And part of it’s not really a joke. I’m like, maybe I should actually buy a house. I don’t know.

Kristine:

We will send each other posts. That’s also-

Tori Dunlap:

Oh yeah.

Kristine:

Oh, that’s another thing.

Tori Dunlap:

We have not talked about that.

Kristine:

That’s also another thing that we do during quarantine to make ourselves feel better, is we will go on Zillow.

Tori Dunlap:

Christine sent me my now dream home, which is this beautiful house in New Orleans that sold in December. I look at the Redfin listing of this house at least once a week. It is on… Speaking of vision board, a photo of this house is on my vision board.

Kristine:

Oh really?

Tori Dunlap:

I love this house more than certain dead relatives of mine. So, so, so much. And yeah, that’s what… And we also G chat during the day. That’s the other thing that people don’t realize because G chat was so… That was the way everybody communicated when we were at our first company. Do you guys still largely communicate through G chat?

Kristine:

Yeah.

Tori Dunlap:

That still a thing?

Kristine:

Yeah. That’s pretty much-

Tori Dunlap:

Yeah. Which is weird, because I think a lot of companies have moved to Slack and everything, but it’s still… It was G chat. So I know that she will be on her email during the day. And I don’t think we… We’ve kind of gotten away from it a little bit in quarantine, that you work from home. But we G chat each other during the day, when we’re at work and at our desk it’s like G chatting each other.

Kristine:

Like Zillow or Airbnbs that we want to stay in.

Tori Dunlap:

Oh yeah. And that’s the other thing about traveling, is people ask, how do you find these places? We either find tags on Instagram… We follow all of these travel accounts, and then we will save them and look at photos that people have taken in those locations. Or we just scour Airbnb. That is a hobby of mine. I have hundreds and hundreds of Airbnbs saved to travel to when all this shit is over.

Kristine:

Yeah.

Tori Dunlap:

I have them grouped by trip, by potential trip, and yeah, that’s a hobby of ours now.

Kristine:

That’s another thing I’m really proud of us, is that we focus on what’s really important. But also too, I think in the scheme of things, we have a budget and we’re reasonable.

Tori Dunlap:

Yeah.

Kristine:

I think a lot of people thinking that traveling is just only for wealthy people or whatever, but we really prioritize it.

Tori Dunlap:

Well, we… I wrote a Business Insider article about it. We went to Italy, friend-moon 2019, patent pending. [crosstalk 01:06:53]

Kristine:

Both. We’re going to sell actual products.

Tori Dunlap:

Yeah. Friend-moon, patent pending 2019, was Italy. And I wrote an article for Business Insider. We did that trip for under $2,000 each, which sound like a lot, but going to Italy for 10 days for under $2K, and we got to do a bunch of shit.

Kristine:

Yeah. We went-

Tori Dunlap:

That was a pretty great trip.

Kristine:

On a catamaran to Capri. We did a tour of a farm where afterwards, they just gave us a huge platter of mozzarella and burrata. And-

Tori Dunlap:

That was the best day of my life. Not an exaggeration. That was top three days of my life. Bar none. So good. Yeah, and then we had this three hour dinner in Positano that was eight courses. And that was probably, what, $200 a piece, $150? We split a bottle of wine too.

Kristine:

And then that’s when Sufjan Stevens’ Mystery of Love played.

Tori Dunlap:

If you want to live vicariously through us, both of us have friend-moon ’19 story highlights on our Instagram, and you can see the exact moment we’re talking about. It is the best moment. It’s so fun. It’s, yeah. I think the key for us has been finding good flight deals. That is how we’ve been able to travel on a budget, and so cheap, is we’re not worried about going during peak season. We actually didn’t have the best weather in Italy, because we went in early October, but it was worth it. Because we got a flight for less than $500.

Kristine:

And if we would’ve gone to the trip to Australia round trip, we would’ve spent [crosstalk 01:08:41]

Tori Dunlap:

Oh, we were talking about this the other day and it pained me, because I didn’t realize how cheap we had gotten it, but you’re exactly right.

Kristine:

Yeah. Round trip tickets for $500 basically. And we could have done it for just 60,000 points, but we decided to-

Tori Dunlap:

It was like 30,000 miles plus $500. You’re lucky if you find a flight under, what, $1,500 to Australia? We got very, very lucky. And then of course we then get to go on that fucking trip. I saved my points for that. I’ve been saving my points for years for Australia and New Zealand.

Kristine:

Yeah. Well hopefully they’ll have it again soon. Which is funny when you’re talking about safety, because a memory just popped up of our trip in Montana. It’s so funny. We’ve traveled internationally, but I think the most time where I’ve been scared is in boondocks of Montana, Wyoming.

Tori Dunlap:

And honestly, I don’t want to tell the story because I feel like it’s going to freak people out. In retrospect, it was probably just fine. We ended up having somebody, and we felt like they were following us while we were driving, and we didn’t have cell service, and we didn’t have any weapons on us. We’re not driving with guns or knives.

Kristine:

We had bear mace.

Tori Dunlap:

We had to get… We had bear mace, which honestly was probably a better weapon, because you could use it from further away. But yeah, that was the first time I think either of us… And that was friend-moon… That was the third friend-moon. So I think that was the first time you and I have ever honestly felt nervous about our safety.

Kristine:

But I think we are really good about paying attention to those things and our intuition, and knowing how to-

Tori Dunlap:

Yep. And sticking together, and taking one for the team when we have to take one for the team.

Kristine:

Are we going to tell that story?

Tori Dunlap:

You can tell that story, that’s fine.

Kristine:

Okay.

Tori Dunlap:

I don’t care.

Kristine:

So friend-moon 2019, we didn’t even just go to Italy. We also were in London for-

Tori Dunlap:

Went to London.

Kristine:

A few days. So Tori, throughout the trip, jokingly said, oh, I’m going to make out with somebody. Oh, I’m going to make out with a hot Italian guy. I’m going to make out with a British guy or something like that. And I’m hearing this and I’m like, well, if it doesn’t happen, we’re just going to make it happen in some way.

Kristine:

So the last night, we actually had a flight at something like 6:00 in the morning, 6:30 or something in the morning. So we had the brilliant idea of just staying up all night until our flight. And so then we can sleep on the plane right back. And we had just gone to see Waitress, or Matilda? I think it was Matilda. And after that, we should just go back and go to sleep. And I’m like, oh I’m hungry. Let’s go get Indian food. We haven’t gotten Indian food yet. And she was like, oh, okay. And then after that, we were walking by a pub. I’m like, oh we got to go to a pub. And so they… Let’s go in for one drink. So we went into this pub, and they were singing the Beatles-

Tori Dunlap:

Hey Jude.

Kristine:

Huh?

Tori Dunlap:

Hey Jude.

Kristine:

Yeah, they were singing Hey Jude. And so we’re just drinking a beer and singing Hey Jude, and then after that.

PART 3 OF 4 ENDS [01:12:04]

Kristine:

[inaudible 01:12:01] … and singing Hey Jude. And then after that, we went to the bar across the street.

Tori Dunlap:

Yeah. Because that bar shut down, which made no sense. It was like 10:00 at night, and they’re like, “We’re closing.” And I’m like [inaudible 01:12:13] … where are we?

Kristine:

I know!

Tori Dunlap:

Like what is this? You’re closing at 10:00?

Kristine:

This is when it’s supposed to get started.

Tori Dunlap:

I know.

Kristine:

So we went to the bar next to us and had a few drinks. And then this guy started talking to me who was pretty tipsy, he was pretty drunk. But he was there with a friend, this Irish guy who was sober. I’m like, oh, he’s Irish, totally going to like him. So they made eye contact across the bar.

Tori Dunlap:

Yeah.

Kristine:

And so I was all right, I’m taking it for the team and chatted with [crosstalk 01:12:44]-

Tori Dunlap:

This, get yourself a friend like Kristine, everybody. If you do not have a best friend who is willing to talk to a tipsy guy for an hour, who already has a boyfriend, who is not interested in this person at all, but just has to keep him entertained so that her best friend can go make out with this Irish man she just met in a bar, you need a friend like that. You need a friend like that.

Kristine:

I was like all right, cool. I’m like oh, they’re starting to make out a bit. Oh, they’re making out [crosstalk 01:13:21]-

Tori Dunlap:

[crosstalk 01:13:21] … when you say it like that, it sounds absolutely [inaudible 01:13:21].

Kristine:

But in my head, I’m like, “Yes.” [inaudible 01:13:23].

Tori Dunlap:

Well, the plan was an Italian guy, because Italian guys are really hot. And then it was always kind of a joke. Like it wasn’t like I was seeking this out. It was like, oh, that would be a fun experience, LOL-

Kristine:

Mm-hmm (affirmative).

Tori Dunlap:

… and then last night we’re in Europe. No, literally, I don’t know if you remember this. The guy who’s obviously, his name was Sean, because he’s Irish.

Kristine:

Mm-hmm (affirmative).

Tori Dunlap:

He literally made eye contact with me and literally made a come hither-like motion with his hand. And I was like [RIP B 01:13:51].

Kristine:

Oh, yeah.

Tori Dunlap:

Like oh boy. And then we were riding a double decker bus at 3:30 back to our Airbnb, and we had to get up at 6:30 to be back, to get on a plane. And yes, the experience was great, but I was so angry at you [crosstalk 01:14:07]-

Kristine:

I know. And I’m like-

Tori Dunlap:

… mad at you. Because we got up, and I had not slept. And you might not know this about me if you don’t know me, but I am a demon without sleep. Like I’m not fun to be around. I just don’t function. And so three hours of sleep later, I got up, and I was so tired. And I was like why did we do that? Like why? And we had to take the subway, and then take a train to get to the airport. And I normally don’t sleep on flights, I just can’t sleep on flights, and it was a nonstop back to Seattle, and I slept for six out of the eight hours, and it was a great choice in hindsight. It was a fantastic choice. It was like get her exhausted. I have like two, three hours of sleep, wake up, go on a plane, but then you get to sleep the whole way home.

Kristine:

Mm-hmm (affirmative). And then just woke up, had breakfast or lunch or something, and then w
e landed.

Tori Dunlap:

Or the video of you getting licked by the cow, and then us having to lie to Customs on the way back.

Kristine:

Mm-hmm (affirmative). And it was like we both knew, because we were getting questioned separately. We both were like, “You didn’t say [crosstalk 01:15:13]-“

Tori Dunlap:

We were telepathically telling each other, “Do not answer, ‘Yes.'” Because literally, it was like six questions. First question is like, “Are you bringing more than $10,000 of currency in?” And we’re like, “No.” And the second question was like, “Oh, do you have weapons? Like guns, whatever.”

Kristine:

[crosstalk 01:15:25]-

Tori Dunlap:

And we’re like, “No.” And the third question, I don’t remember. It was like something ridiculous. So they’re probably like-

Kristine:

[crosstalk 01:15:30]-

Tori Dunlap:

“Are you bringing a human being that didn’t come?” “No.” And then last three questions were like, “Have you been to a farm or agricultural site?” And we were like, “No.”

Kristine:

“No.”

Tori Dunlap:

And then the fifth one was like, “Are you transporting goods from a farm or agricultural site, like dairy products?” And we’re like, “You mean the block of cheese in Kristine‘s suitcase?”

Kristine:

“No.”

Tori Dunlap:

“No.” And then the final one was like, “Did you touch any livestock?” And we’re like, “You mean the video that we posted of us petting cows and donkeys and getting licked by them?”

Kristine:

“No.”

Tori Dunlap:

“No.” And then we were on our way out, and I just like… Because I met up with her, and then we were just dragging her suitcases, and we didn’t say anything for like the first 30 seconds out of Customs. And I go, I think you turned to me, and you’re like, “You said, ‘No,’ right?” And I was like, “Oh, yeah [crosstalk 01:16:26]-“

Kristine:

[crosstalk 01:16:26]-

Tori Dunlap:

“… I didn’t say anything.”

Kristine:

It’s so funny because we’re like, “If they just followed us on Instagram, [crosstalk 01:16:35]-“

Tori Dunlap:

It would have been, “Oh, they knew everything.” They would know everything.

Kristine:

Seeing us like buying cheese and touching cows.

Tori Dunlap:

And going to a farm, agricultural location.

Kristine:

Mm-hmm (affirmative). Yeah. I’ve never lied ever.

Tori Dunlap:

Ever.

Kristine:

Oops.

Tori Dunlap:

I know this-

Kristine:

[crosstalk 01:16:55]-

Tori Dunlap:

… and I love you.

Kristine:

Oh, let’s see. Oh, there’s a question that Mary actually suggested.

Tori Dunlap:

Hm.

Kristine:

She said, “What was your first purchase that you felt like, ‘Ooh, this is really luxurious?’ And then second, what was a purchase that you were like you felt that way, but it was totally worth it? You’d be like, ‘Oh, this is a really good-‘”

Tori Dunlap:

The most recent one I can think of is my $350 washable silk robe.

Kristine:

Mm.

Tori Dunlap:

Sipping wine-

Kristine:

[crosstalk 01:17:28]-

Tori Dunlap:

… in a robe. Like it’s very… Yeah, I feel very fancy in it.

Kristine:

Mm-hmm (affirmative).

Tori Dunlap:

And it’s something about knowing it’s really well made and also knowing I paid a lot of money for it makes me feel more fancy. I’m trying to think if there’s anything before that.

Kristine:

And this is something that Tori’s been wanting for a while. Like we were-

Tori Dunlap:

Yeah.

Kristine:

… in Italy, so this is 2019, and she was like, “Oh, I think we should get like lingerie or something.” [crosstalk 01:17:53]-

Tori Dunlap:

Or robes, yeah.

Kristine:

“Or robes, yeah.”

Tori Dunlap:

Like silk robes, yeah.

Kristine:

And so we go into this [crosstalk 01:17:58]-

Tori Dunlap:

Oh, God.

Kristine:

This like hole-in-the-wall shop, and we’re like, “Oh, we should be able to find something reasonable.” And everything was like $500 an up or something?

Tori Dunlap:

Oh, 700, 800. Some of these like… It was like a silk camisole-

Kristine:

Mm-hmm (affirmative).

Tori Dunlap:

… for like $220, and I was like, “Fuck, no.”

Kristine:

[crosstalk 01:18:16]-

Tori Dunlap:

Maybe even more than that, I’m trying to remember. I remember seeing a couple thousand dollars things that should not have been a thousand dollars.

Kristine:

Mm-hmm (affirmative).

Tori Dunlap:

And I was like, “Mm, no. No way, Jose.” So yeah, that’s a good reminder is like yeah, I spent $350 on this thing, but I’ve wanted it for literally years, and it’s also something that will last me for a long time.

Kristine:

And it’s literally for you.

Tori Dunlap:

But I’m trying to think if there’s anything else. I mean, I grew up really frugal. I’m still pretty frugal, so I have to teach myself to spend money. Like I have to still, like even that robe was like, “Oh, my God. You just spent 350 on a robe?” And it’s like, “Well, yeah. You’ve wanted it for a really long time.” But you’re like, “Yeah, but you spent 350 on a robe?!”

Kristine:

Mm-hmm (affirmative).

Tori Dunlap:

Like yeah, you will live in that robe. You know? It’s like two sides, like left brain, right brain, of like, “You’re going to do this?” “Yeah, that makes perfect sense.” “Really? That’s a lot of money.” So yeah, I would say probably a silk robe’s good example.

Kristine:

Mm-hmm (affirmative).

Tori Dunlap:

I mean, a lot of our travel. Like a lot of our travel, even if we are doing it on a budget, it often feels very luxurious, which is fun.

Kristine:

Yeah, and something that we’ll have a conversation, too, is I don’t make as much as Tori does, and so this is going to be like a new thing that we’re going to have to-

Tori Dunlap:

Yeah.

Kristine:

… confront about like my budget still hasn’t really changed from [crosstalk 01:19:31]-

Tori Dunlap:

[crosstalk 01:19:31] … you and I have not gone on an international trip that since really I started making more money.

Kristine:

Mm-hmm (affirmative).

Tori Dunlap:

So and so that’s the other thing is we talk about money. I mean, it’s kind of a pre-requisite to be friends with me.

Kristine:

Mm-hmm (affirmative).

Tori Dunlap:

But like we talk about money quite a lot. And it’s like this is a conversation we had before trips of like, “What are we willing to spend? Who’s going to spend money on what thing? And how is that going to work in our budget?”

Kristine:

I’m really fortunate. Sometimes, I feel like did you ever watch the movie Sabrina?

Tori Dunlap:

The teenage witch?

Kristine:

No, there was a Sabrina-

Tori Dunlap:

You’re talking Audrey Hepburn?

Kristine:

There’s the Audrey Hepburn one, and then-

Tori Dunlap:

Yeah.

Kristine:

… they also did a remake with like Harrison Ford.

Tori Dunlap:

Actually, I think I watched it in Ireland with Aaron. I think that was an Aaron special, is he’s like, “We have to watch Sabrina.”

Kristine:

Oh, really?

Tori Dunlap:

Yeah.

Kristine:

Do you remember Audrey Hepburn’s dad, or Sabrina’s dad is the butler for a wealthy family? And it turns out-

Tori Dunlap:

Yes.

Kristine:

… at the end of the movie, he’s like, “I’m actually worth millions.” And they’re like, “What?” And he goes, “Yeah. Being a butler, I could hear all of the business conversations about like when to buy, when to sell, and I-“

Tori Dunlap:

Oh, right.

Kristine:

“And I bought and sold when they did, and so I made a lot of money.” So I feel like I’m very fortunate being best friends with you, that we have these conversations openly, and it definitely made me prioritize and realize like what… I think more specifically. Like I grew up being told like, “Yeah, you need to save. You save for retirement,” but nothing specific. It was just like very broad conversations.

Tori Dunlap:

Yeah.

Kristine:

So I’m very fortunate in that, and it allows me a lot of freedom that I normally wouldn’t have.

Tori Dunlap:

Well, that’s kind. Thank you.

Kristine:

Yeah. Thank you so much, and I’m going to use that money.

Tori Dunlap:

Thank you. My God. Oh, my God.

Kristine:

Oh, the last question that I think will just be like a fun question that I saw [Phoebe Robertson 01:21:27]-

Tori Dunlap:

Mm-hmm (affirmative)?

Kristine:

… posed to [Amber Ruffin 01:21:29].

Tori Dunlap:

Oh.

Kristine:

But it is, if you could go into any person’s body for a day, living or dead, who would it be and on what day? I feel like that says-

Tori Dunlap:

Ooh.

Kristine:

… a lot about a person. As soon as I was like thinking about it.

Tori Dunlap:

I’m going to walk you through. And these are not my final choices, but I’m going to walk you through my first, like immediate, immediate answers. Natalie Portman, F. Scott Fitzgerald.

Kristine:

Natalie Portman, and on what day?

Tori Dunlap:

She just seems so chic, like I’ll take any day in frickin’ Natalie Portman’s life. Like I don’t… Oh, probably on the day she was like shooting make out scenes with Hayden Christensen. Like that feels like a pretty good day to pick.

Kristine:

Mm-hmm (affirmative).

Tori Dunlap:

I just love Natalie Portman. She’s very much a role model. Or like Zelda Fitzgerald I think would even be more fascinating [crosstalk 01:22:14]-

Kristine:

On which particular day? I think that’s like the big thing. It’s like what day?

Tori Dunlap:

Yeah. Yeah. Because those, actually, those three came to my head before you had finished what particular day? What was her answer? Now I’m curious.

Kristine:

Her-

Tori Dunlap:

Do you remember Amber Ruffin’s answer?

Kristine:

Yeah. It was Janet Jackson on tour. Because she said that she does stand up, and going up on stage is probably very different than being-

Tori Dunlap:

Yeah.

Kristine:

… a singer and performer to go up on stage.

Tori Dunlap:

That’s a good point.

Kristine:

And then she’s like, “Oh, I would love to go up on stage-“

Tori Dunlap:

Oh.

Kristine:

“… and just hit the choreography real hard.”

Tori Dunlap:

Oh, yeah. Then if we’re talking that, that’s a really good answer. I’d want to be Beyonce at Coachella.

Kristine:

Mm, that’s a good answer.

Tori Dunlap:

Oh, wow. Yeah, bottle that experience up and sell it for like a million dollars a bottle. Like oh, my God.

Kristine:

Mm-hmm (affirmative).

Tori Dunlap:

To feel literally like a God-

Kristine:

Mm-hmm (affirmative).

Tori Dunlap:

… and oh, man.

Kristine:

Yeah.

Tori Dunlap:

Beyonce on the homecoming Coachella tour. It wasn’t even a tour, performance. Oh, man.

Kristine:

Something me and Sarah, Sarah’s a friend, talked about.

Tori Dunlap:

Yeah.

Kristine:

And they said, “Oh, why don’t… I would probably do like Lady Gaga.” And I was like, “Oh, yeah. Lady Gaga at like a Grammy’s performance.”

Tori Dunlap:

Yeah.

Kristine:

So they get to perform, then they get to meet all [crosstalk 01:23:31]-

Tori Dunlap:

You get to like win Grammy’s. Oh, you get to meet everybody.

Kristine:

Yeah. Win Grammy’s, and then party all night.

Tori Dunlap:

Well, and that’s what I thought of like immediately. When I thought, I was like, “Natalie Portman at the Oscars.” But like she’s, you don’t win. And then, one, you don’t even go to because you’re pregnant.

Kristine:

Oh, that’s right. So she hasn’t won an Oscar yet?

Tori Dunlap:

I’m trying to think. And now in my head, I’m like, “Did she win an Oscar?”

Kristine:

Did she not win it for like Black Swan or something?

Tori Dunlap:

No, it was for Black Swan.

Kristine:

Yeah.

Tori Dunlap:

She’s been nominated twice since, and has not one. Maybe it’s Saoirse Ronan so, again, I can make out with Timothée Chalamet. But I don’t want my days to just be like I get to make out with hot famous person. Yeah, I think… And oh, now, I’ve really, this is like another hour of just you and I talking about this. This was like the question we posed to each other the other week of like what famous person do you think you could hit on and actually have a chance with?

Kristine:

Yeah.

Tori Dunlap:

That was an hour-long conversation between Kristine and I.

Kristine:

Mm-hmm (affirmative).

Tori Dunlap:

That was an hour-long [inaudible 01:24:22] … conversation between you and I. Honestly I think, yeah, Beyonce on Coachella. Especially like knowing how hard you’ve worked, because she worked… And that’s the other thing is I would get to be in that body and have that experience without any of the hard [crosstalk 01:24:35]-

Kristine:

[crosstalk 01:24:36]-

Tori Dunlap:

Like I wouldn’t have to work for nine months to get the orchestration down and get the whatever, work off like the baby weight. Like I wouldn’t have to do that.

Kristine:

Mm-mm (negative).

Tori Dunlap:

It’d be like cool.

Kristine:

Just have the energy.

Tori Dunlap:

Yeah, just show up, and…

Tori Dunlap:

And also, no, because it’s just your brain. So the body’s going to do what it’s supposed to do.

Kristine:

Mm-hmm (affirmative).

Tori Dunlap:

I guess has to tell the body. But in this hypothetical scenario, I know all the choreography, and I know what I’m going to do, and yeah, yeah.

Kristine:

That’s a good one.

Tori Dunlap:

That’d be pretty… Yeah. That’s probably… I don’t know. I’m sure there’s a better answer, but that’s the best answer I can think of.

Kristine:

Well, do you have anything that also that you’d want to ask yourself? Or something that I didn’t [crosstalk 01:25:11]-

Tori Dunlap:

No, this was fun. Anything that you want to tell people?

Kristine:

Well, I definitely probably was wanting to wait till the end to say this, but yeah, just how incredibly proud I am of you-

Tori Dunlap:

Stop.

Kristine:

… professionally and personally.

Tori Dunlap:

I’m so proud of you. Obviously, we’re not going to talk on the podcast about it, but Kristine‘s been through a lot of shit, y’all. Kristine‘s been through a lot of shit in the past couple years and, my God, she’s handled it with grace and strength, and I’m just honored to be your best friend.

Kristine:

Thank you. And that was not a prompt for you to give me [crosstalk 01:25:50]-

Tori Dunlap:

No, I know. I know. But we’re not going to… I mean, I’m awesome. You’re also awesome, and we need to talk about how we’re both awesome at the same time.

Kristine:

I think it’s so amazing how your voice really speaks with people, and if that means that it can make things a little bit more equal and women have more power, then hell yeah, hell fucking yeah.

Tori Dunlap:

That’s the whole deal. That’s the whole idea.

Kristine:

Mm-hmm (affirmative). And also, too, I think coming from a best friend, personal growth obviously is amazing.

Kristine:

I will also say one of the things that, being in this position, seeing how you’ve handled when people have said terrible things to you. One, it’s amazing that you can bounce back from that. And also, really hard for me not to want to start a bunch of fights and be that petty bitch when I see it. And I think a lot of people don’t really realize the conversations that maybe me and Tori are having off of Instagram.

Tori Dunlap:

Yeah.

Kristine:

Or people who only have a small snapshot of something that you’ve said or have done, instead of really-

Tori Dunlap:

Yeah.

Kristine:

… following you or knowing who you are. So I really appreciate. I think one of the biggest things that we’re able to still be friends and to grow as friends is just your ability to listen. You’re great at talking, but you’re also really great at listening. You’re an amazing talker, but you’re also a good listener, as well.

Tori Dunlap:

You form words into sentence good. That’s funny you say. That’s really kind, because I feel like I have a lot of work to do to be a good listener.

Kristine:

But I’ll say, I think but the thing is is that you are willing to listen, and you are putting in work to do that. People can take that, and just let it fall off their back. But I feel like similarly, like with the practice of Buddhism where you’re always constantly trying to better yourself as a person-

Tori Dunlap:

Yeah.

Kristine:

… I think that’s something that you’re really conscientious about, so-

Tori Dunlap:

I try to be. I don’t want to be a person who never changes or never grows. That’s no fun. No fun to be, no fun to be around.

Kristine:

And everybody has different experiences, so yeah, it’s we can’t really form things and say everybody fits in a bubble.

Tori Dunlap:

Yeah. Well, and I think one of the things I love about our friendship is that we’ve really had to work to assume positive intent, always, always, always. And that’s something that doesn’t come naturally to me unfortunately, and something that I’ve had to work on. And something that I think we’ve strengthened within each other is that neither one of us are trying to hurt each other. Neither one of us are trying to say something mean, or ignorant, or any of those things. And sometimes, it happens and it’s understanding that that’s not what they meant, and then asking, “What did you mean by that?”

Kristine:

Mm-hmm (affirmative).

Tori Dunlap:

Or like, “Tell me more about what you just said.” And that way, we’re able to typically work through something that could have been an explosion by assuming you knew what this person meant, right? Or assuming that they were trying to hurt you, or assuming that the way you’re feeling, whether hurt or frustrated, is how they intended you to feel. Because I think nine times out of 10, anybody is not trying to piss you off hopefully.

Kristine:

Yeah. And I think we’re mature enough, thankfully, that we understand what that can look like, and we try-

Tori Dunlap:

Yeah.

Kristine:

… to not do that. I just love you, and I thank you so [crosstalk 01:29:39]-

Tori Dunlap:

I love you. I love you so much. Thanks for being on. Tell people where they can find you.

Kristine:

Well, pre-COVID, I used to perform on stage. But now post-COVID, you can find me on Instagram, @KZOTA. And then, I don’t know, TikTok. It’s going to be, it’s heykota. Hey, K-O-T-A.

Tori Dunlap:

K-O-T-A? And I can’t believe we got through this whole thing without discussing this, but Kristine is a semi-professional improvisational comedian, and a damn good one at that. So if you’re into improv, if you like… And you should check out her work, and if you are local to Seattle or Los Angeles, she splits her time between Seattle and LA. And if you’re listening to this when improv is a thing again, come see Kristine‘s shows. She’s very good at what she does, and that support I know would mean a lot to her.

Kristine:

Thank you. Yeah. I’m hoping I’ll-

Tori Dunlap:

[crosstalk 01:30:37]-

Kristine:

… get to have more time, and hopefully put more stuff out there.

Tori Dunlap:

Yay.

Kristine:

Because who knows when things will be back up and running.

Tori Dunlap:

You good?

Kristine:

I’m great. How are you feeling?

Tori Dunlap:

I’m good. Love you.

Kristine:

I love you, best friend.

Tori Dunlap:

This is the last episode of season one of Financial Feminist. And in the understatement of the year, we have to say this season went pretty well. I cannot thank you enough for your support of our show, for showing up in every way to hype it up, and working to spread our mission of financial feminism. A huge shout out to our guests for taking time to be on the show. And to my incredible team at Her First $100K, could not have done this without you.

Tori Dunlap:

If you don’t already know, I have signed a book deal with Harper Collins, and my manuscript is due soon, and I am nowhere close to being done. So now that season one of the podcast is wrapped up, getting my book draft done is top of our to-do list. So in this hiatus between seasons one and two, please continue supporting the show. We want to keep the momentum going. We want the show to impact as many people as possible to change as many lives as possible. So please keep subscribing, and sharing, and telling your community even during our little bit of a break here.

Tori Dunlap:

And if you want more information about what we discussed in this episode or previous episodes, more information about Kristine, myself, and the show, check out our detailed show notes at financialfeministpodcast.com. And if you’re ready to get started in your financial journey, you can head over to HerFirst100k.com/start.

Tori Dunlap:

Until I see you again, thanks for being financial feminists. Love y’all, and I’ll talk to you soon.

Tori Dunlap:

Thank you for listening to Financial Feminist. Financial Feminist is produced and hosted by me, Tori Dunlap. Theme song and audio production by Jonah Cohen Sound. Administration and marketing by Olivia [Cokana 01:32:33], Sophia Cohen, and Kristen Fields. Research by Ariel Johnson. Promotional graphics by Mary Stratton, and photography by S
arah Wolf. A huge thanks to the entire Her First $100K team and community for supporting the show. For more information about Financial Feminist, Her First $100K, our guests, and our sponsors go to FinancialFeministPodcast.com.

PART 4 OF 4 ENDS [01:32:55]