“The biggest thing I didn’t expect as a single mom would be that I had to learn how to rely on strangers.”
When Kim Williams couldn’t find the single mom community she was seeking, she took it upon herself to bridge a significant gap. Kim is the visionary behind Single Black Motherhood, a purpose-driven community dedicated to empowering single mothers through education, resources, and practical tools to enhance their overall quality of life. With empathy and candor, this episode explores the intersection of single parenthood, financial empowerment, and the transformative power of community.
The stats
- 42% of marriages end in divorce
- 1 in 4 children grow up in single-parent homes
- 92% of single parents are mothers and 8% are fathers
- 70% of Americans believe that single women raising children on their own is bad for society
- 78% believe that the single mom stigma is on the rise
As the conversation unfolds, Kim shares that the inspiration behind the Single Black Motherhood community came from a place of frustration in not being able to find resources or content specific to her situation — a young, black, never married single mother. “I felt like everything was lacking, but what I was finding was a bunch of statistics, like data around how little we make, how much we rely on the government. There wasn’t really any inspiration, especially when you talk about single black mothers.”
Most of the information she found was geared toward single white divorced mothers. Those with the support of family and friends…something she didn’t have.”So I started building this community and people would reach out and say thank you, you know, like they were afraid to even share. There’s a lot of shame, especially with all that you see in the media around single black mothers. Some people are still, even to this day, afraid to say they’re a single black mother.”
Tori and Kim go on to discuss the stigmas surrounding single motherhood, shedding light on the societal categorizations and judgments often imposed on single mothers. She acknowledges the prevalent misconceptions and biases that single mothers encounter, particularly within certain communities. Kim reflects, “Society does sort of categorize single moms,” highlighting the pervasive tendency to label and stereotype single mothers based on their circumstances.
She emphasizes the need to challenge these stigmas and foster a culture of inclusivity and support for ALL mothers, regardless of their marital status or family structure. Despite the external judgments, Kim emphasizes the importance of solidarity within the single mother community, advocating for mutual respect and understanding among fellow mothers.
Finding community
Kim emphasizes the transformative power of community and support in the lives of single mothers, urging listeners to cultivate meaningful connections both online and offline. “Finding a supportive network of fellow mothers was a game-changer for me,” Kim shares, highlighting the importance of solidarity and shared experiences. From local mom groups to virtual communities on social media, Kim encourages single mothers to seek out spaces where they can feel seen, heard, and supported. “There are strangers out there that wanna help you if you allow them to.”
Through her work with Single Black Motherhood, Kim strives to create a safe haven where single mothers can find solace, strength, and sisterhood.
Navigating financial challenges
The conversation delves into the intricate landscape of financial struggles and empowerment experienced by single mothers, particularly within the Black community. “Financial stability was a constant uphill battle, but I refused to let it define my future,” Kim asserts, reflecting on her journey towards economic independence. She recommends practical resources like Emma’s “The Wealthy Single Mommy” and Kamiko’s “The Budget Mom” for financial guidance tailored to single mothers.
Kim’s advice empowers single moms to take control of their finances and build a stable future for themselves and their children. As Kim notes, “We have to be open to the tools and resources that are available to us.”
Supporting single mothers
Kim emphasizes the importance of tangible support for single mothers, urging listeners to offer assistance proactively. She shares her personal experience of how small gestures of support, like sending food or offering childcare, can make a significant impact on a single mother’s life. Kim’s message resonates with empathy and compassion, reminding us of the power of community in lifting each other up. As she wisely advises, “Just offering that help, I think, can really be a game-changer for anybody.”
Building resilience
In closing, Kim reiterates the transformative power of connection and community in the journey of single motherhood. She shares personal anecdotes of finding support and camaraderie in unexpected places, highlighting the resilience and strength that emerge from shared experiences. Kim’s story serves as a beacon of hope and inspiration for single mothers, reminding them that they are not alone in their struggles and triumphs.
As Kim eloquently expresses, “I truly believe that you will not regret” opening yourself up to support and connection.
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Meet Kim
When Kim Williams couldn’t find the single mom community she was seeking, she took it upon herself to bridge a significant gap. Kim is the visionary behind Single Black Motherhood, a purpose-driven community dedicated to empowering single mothers through education, resources, and practical tools to enhance their overall quality of life. Her belief in the importance of community support drives her to offer various opportunities for connection, both online and through in-person events, retreats, and meetups. Thanks to her dedicated service, mothers from corners of the globe have found a platform to connect, inspiring lasting transformations in their lives.
Transcript:
Kim Williams:
It’s funny you say this because somebody sent me a video the other day about this lady saying that people were better off not having kids raising them by themselves, and I was just like, where does whole thing come from? There have been so many single moms that have raised successful children, but you don’t see that in the media.
Tori Dunlap:
Hi, Financial Feminists. I’m so excited to see you. Welcome back to the show. We are coming back from our winter break. Thanks for staying with us. We love taking these breaks both because we fucking need them. Our team is producing six episodes a month. It’s really nice to take a week off. And also because you probably need it too. You probably need a little bit of a break to just simmer, maybe go to the back log. So welcome back from the break. I hope you had a amazing week.
Today’s guests were so excited to welcome on the show. When Kim Williams couldn’t find the single mom community she was seeking, she took it upon herself to bridge a significant gap. Kim is the visionary behind Single Black Motherhood, a purpose-driven community dedicated to empowering single mothers through education, resources, and practical tools to enhance their overall quality of life. Her belief in the importance of community support drives her to offer various opportunities for connection, both online and through in-person events, retreats, and meetups.
Thanks to her dedicated service, mothers from corners of the globe have found a platform to connect, inspiring lasting transformation in their lives. Couple of things we talk about in today’s episode, the stigma around single motherhood, especially for Black single mothers. We talk about being a single mom by choice. We also discuss finding work as a single mom that supports parents and how to advocate for yourself in the workplace as a mother, how non-parents like myself can best support the single mothers in their life, and how single mothers can find community with other single moms.
We’re so excited for today’s episode. Regardless of whether you’re a mom or not, this is a good one to listen to. So let’s go ahead and get into it. But first a word from our sponsors. I am digging the wallpaper behind you. That is wallpaper, right?
Kim Williams:
Yes.
Tori Dunlap:
Yeah, it looks like dalmatians and I really like it.
Kim Williams:
Thank you.
Tori Dunlap:
We’re so excited to have you. Thank you so much for being on the show. One of the things we like asking our guests that work in money and talk about money is to describe their first money memory, the first time that they remember thinking about money, and I would love if you could share yours.
Kim Williams:
Oh, that’s hard. The first time I can remember thinking about money was probably when I asked my mom to buy me something and she said she had to wait until the 1st. And I was like, “The 1st? What does that even mean?”
Tori Dunlap:
You’re like, “But I want it now.”
Kim Williams:
Right.
Tori Dunlap:
What did that teach you about money looking back on it, or what was the conclusion of that money memory?
Kim Williams:
So I never really wanted to have to wait until a certain period of time to get what I wanted. I was really young. I don’t remember how old I was, but if I think back to my first memory, that’s definitely it. And I think I started working really young because of that. I started working at the age of 14.
Tori Dunlap:
What was your first job?
Kim Williams:
My first job was working in Subway. I think the title back then was a sandwich artist.
Tori Dunlap:
I think it still is. Yeah.
Kim Williams:
As a kid, you could only work so many hours after school and you had to get a parent to sign for you to be able to work. I think it was around the child labor laws or something like that.
Tori Dunlap:
Yeah, 14 is really, really young. That’s a experience. How many hours a week were you working while going to school?
Kim Williams:
I don’t think you could work over five, maybe 10 hours. It wasn’t a lot at all. Because most of them would be on the weeKim ds when I didn’t have school. I think there was a set time you could work during the week versus what you could work on the weeKim d.
Tori Dunlap:
I think after 15 and 16, the rules are a little bit more lax, but before then. We found in our research about you that you had your daughter when you were 21 and finishing college. What surprised you the most about becoming a mom, and on top of that, becoming a single mom?
Kim Williams:
I think becoming a mom, I just didn’t know what to expect. Growing up we never had conversations around what it actually took to be a mom, what it took to provide for a child. So I just had no clue. I think that would be the biggest thing for me is just like, what do I expect and how do I provide for this kid? I’m a kid. I’m barely taking care of myself.
Tori Dunlap:
Right. Specifically being a single mom, right, because I think it’s difficult enough, of course, being a mother, but there’s an added element if you’re doing that by yourself. That’s significant.
Kim Williams:
Yeah. Probably the biggest thing I didn’t expect as a single mom would be that I had to learn how to rely on strangers, people that I didn’t know, to actually help me.
Tori Dunlap:
And building that trust?
Kim Williams:
Yeah, for sure.
Tori Dunlap:
Trusting people that you don’t know anything about, that’s really scary at times.
Kim Williams:
Yeah, for sure.
Tori Dunlap:
Do you feel like that feeling of not having a clue translated to your financial life? Do you feel like that translated to your money?
Kim Williams:
Absolutely. I have no financial knowledge at all, especially going into motherhood. My mom would use credit cards for a lot of things, so I don’t know. There’s a saying about you do what you see your parents do, not necessarily like you being taught to do something, right? You just pick up these behaviors. And when my daughter was born, I didn’t really have a real job, so I was buying her all of these designer things, just putting them on credit cards.
Tori Dunlap:
Because that’s what you saw your parents do?
Kim Williams:
Because that’s what I saw my mom do.
Tori Dunlap:
When you started your blog, you said you were looking for resources, but there weren’t really any for Black mothers. What kind of content were you finding and what felt like was lacking from that discussion? What was being missed?
Kim Williams:
I felt like everything was lacking, but what I was finding was a bunch of statistics, like data around how little we make, how much we rely on the government. There wasn’t really any inspiration, especially when you talk about single Black mothers.
I couldn’t find anything, and I’m like, I know there has to be somebody out there that is young, single, Black trying to figure out how to escape this check-to-check cycle, and they’ve made it out of this. I know there has to be somebody out there, but I cannot find it. I went looking for podcasts, blogs, people’s Instagram pages. I cannot find a thing.
Tori Dunlap:
Do you feel like the content was geared mostly to white women? Was it geared to women who didn’t have children? What do you feel like the demographic was versus you said all these things were missing? I wanted somebody young. I want somebody Black. I wanted somebody who was a mother. Who was the content geared towards that you were finding?
Kim Williams:
So the content that I found was geared towards I felt like single white mothers that had been previously divorced. I had never been married, right? So some of the things I couldn’t relate to because maybe they had alimony or they were getting child support.
I wasn’t getting child support. I didn’t have any alimony. They had communities. They had families that were really big on supporting them. I didn’t have any of that. And so some of the things I did take from some of the blogs that I found out there, but other things I just really couldn’t relate to.
Tori Dunlap:
It’s interesting you say this lack of community because I’m not a mother. If I choose to be, that part of my life hasn’t happened. I think one of the things that I have discussed though with my friends who are parents and especially mothers is it’s just like… I mean, we know the phrase it takes a village and it’s so difficult to raise children, but it’s just almost impossible to do it without that sense of community.
So what was that feeling like for you? You said having to rely on strangers, but how did you figure out how you were going to make this work for you if you didn’t have that community and you didn’t have that support and you didn’t have alimony? How did you navigate that?
Kim Williams:
I think I’ve always grown up with this mindset of you have to do what you to do and you will figure it out. So I just developed that mentality. But as I got into listening to podcasts back then, I learned about community and how these moms were meeting other moms. And they weren’t single moms, but they were married moms or they were the white single moms and they were building communities and they were having meetups.
And I’m like, maybe this is it. Maybe I could actually find people that want to do what I want to do or that have already done it and we could help each other. And so that is where I got the idea to create this community. First I started off with the podcast because I’m like, I have to tell my story. How else will people connect with me if I don’t share what I’m going through?
So I started there and then I started building this community and people would reach out and say thank you. They were afraid to even share. There’s a lot of shame, especially with all that you see in the media around single Black mothers. Some people are still even to this day afraid to say they’re a single Black mother. They hide behind that.
Tori Dunlap:
Well, let’s talk about that stigma for a second because in our research too there’s just… I mean, I didn’t even know how deep this shit goes. Stigma in terms of applying for jobs or not being able to get housing in the same way. So what are some of the areas of stigma that single moms face that you’ve either seen firsthand or in stories from your community?
Kim Williams:
Yeah, I think career is one thing. It’s like most of the times they aren’t in leadership because of what they have to do at home, or they’re afraid. They’re afraid to go after the higher paying jobs because they fear that they won’t have the support that they need to continue climbing that ladder, so to speak. Income is also a big thing outside of the career just in general of making the money.
And I think that just goes back to being able to climb the ladder or do the things that they need to do. I think relying on the government, that’s a big stigma. Honestly, I haven’t even met a lot of single moms that get access to government. I think one of the biggest misconceptions is that we are all relying on the government for financial assistance or housing.
Most of us don’t even qualify for it because we are right over that poverty line and we can’t even get access to any benefits because of that. I know even for me, when I became a single mom, I would’ve loved to have got some type of funding, but it was like, you don’t qualify because you have one kid. And I think back then maybe the income was like 28,000, but because I made 30,000, I couldn’t get any type of help. So I think that’s another misconception. It’s so crazy.
Tori Dunlap:
And that lack of support, I mean, always on the show we talk about the lack of support, but also at a societal level. It’s very hard for anybody in a minority group to succeed. It was just bootstraps mentality. We all know this. And then when the policies fail us, it’s so difficult to navigate. When we’re looking at motherhood, specifically single motherhood, what are some of the extra costs associated with being a single mom?
And to go even further, a mom of color? As someone who’s not a mother, if anybody’s listening who maybe is a mother but has a partner or is child free, what does that look like in terms of actual costs to motherhood and to single motherhood?
Kim Williams:
Yeah, I think probably the biggest cost is childcare because we don’t have anybody to drop our kids off in the morning before we go to work or pick them up after they get out of school. The school hours don’t align with our work schedules. So that’s one of the biggest added costs. And a lot of moms, again, can’t even get help with childcare funding because of the whole income thing.
That’s one big thing I think just too is just having to provide for the kids on our own. Especially if you’re a single mom, you don’t get any child support. You’re not co-parenting. You have to take care of all of the kids’ needs. If you want to do extracurricular activities for your kids, school, whatever their expenses are, you’re taking that on versus being able to share that load with somebody.
Tori Dunlap:
Yeah, I think the childcare thing we have to spend some more time talking about. Because I live in Seattle, the cost of childcare is as much as rent, typically double. How is that sustainable?
Kim Williams:
It’s so crazy.
Tori Dunlap:
How is that sustainable? How did you manage that? How did that work for you?
Kim Williams:
So back then, my daughter, I want to say when she first started going to school, obviously her dad and I, we created this agreement to where he’d reimburse me for half of the expenses. So that is how I did it back then. But today, she actually goes to after school that is done by the hospital that I work for. I believe it’s subsidized for workers, so it’s not as expensive as it was when she was growing up.
So I just do it that way. But I know a lot of moms don’t have that same story. And so honestly, I don’t know how they’re doing it because it’s way more expensive now than it was back then. And I think I was just putting stuff on credit cards, to be honest. I couldn’t even afford to live making 30,000 with all the bills and debt that I had. So yeah, I think thinking back, I was just living off of credit cards, to be honest with you.
Tori Dunlap:
And this is, again, where policy has to come in, universal child care, at least subsidized child care, and continually policies fail to support moms.
Kim Williams:
And you don’t want to put your kid in any type of, well, at least I wouldn’t, any type of childcare. So I was thinking…
Tori Dunlap:
You want to make sure it’s safe and healthy and developmental and all of that.
Kim Williams:
If you’re forward-thinking about their development, it’s like, well, the basic daycare that’s the cheapest is not teaching them anything, especially as babies, right? So then the more you want your kid to learn, it seems like the more expensive it is. So yeah, that’s something to consider also.
Tori Dunlap:
Well, and to your point about extracurriculars, you want a well-rounded kid who is doing things that they love and who takes piano or goes to soccer practice, and all of those things cost money. All of those things cost money and time and the emotional labor of scheduling. And so yeah, it’s a lot to think about.
Kim Williams:
And I see a lot of moms now, especially in my community, that they put extracurricular activities before their own financial needs, if that makes sense. And I have to remind them that you don’t owe your kids these extracurricular activities. It’s cool to just have them do one thing, but I sometimes feel like they’re overcompensating because the other parent is not there, or they didn’t have this when they were growing up. And so it’s a huge thing.
Tori Dunlap:
We talk about this a lot. If people are in a financial position to help pay for college, a lot of parents end up sacrificing their own retirements to take care of their kids and to try to get them to at least graduate with less debt or graduate debt-free. But the issue for that is as much as student loans suck, you can take out a loan. You can’t take out a loan for your own retirement.
And if you’re trying to do this really great thing, which is set your kid up for financial success, but they’re going to end up paying for you in retirement, that’s actually not as good of a decision as you think it is. It sounds like a different version of that.
Kim Williams:
Yeah, for sure. And they do that too, and they’re a single mom community. And it’s oftentimes like, are you saving for retirement?
Tori Dunlap:
It’s well-intentioned.
Kim Williams:
And they’re like, no, they’re not saving for themselves for their future, but they’re saving for their kids’ future.
Tori Dunlap:
I think the psychological, if I had to interpret that, I think it’s like we have taught women and specifically mothers to be so self-sacrificing, right? And in order to be a quote “good mom,” you have to give your kids the life that you didn’t have and sacrifice your joy and happiness and stability for them.
If you look at it in the long term, that’s really difficult if you grow up as a kid and you realize, “Oh, my mom was never happy. My mom is not financially well off. And now either I have to pay for her or I have to deal with that in terms of the emotional impact that that had.” So it’s just like it’s, again, really well-intentioned, but I think it ends up having these negative consequences.
Kim Williams:
Yeah, and I think to go a step further is not only does it impact them financially, but also mentally, right?
Tori Dunlap:
Totally.
Kim Williams:
A lot of moms have struggled mentally because of the decisions they’ve made financially. And that transfers over into the kids and they don’t really realize that a lot.
Tori Dunlap:
We found in the research this statistic that’s just absolutely awful, which is that 70% of Americans believe that single women raising children on their own is bad for society. I know. Do you have any thoughts on why this belief is so persuasive and if there’s anything we can do to dismantle that kind of thinking?
Kim Williams:
You know what? It’s funny you say this because somebody sent me a video, I believe it was on Instagram, the other day similar to this about this lady saying that people were better off not having kids raising them by themselves. And I was just like, where does this whole thing come from? There have been so many single moms that have raised successful children, but you don’t see that in the media.
And so I think if we all work together to share those stories of those women that have come before us that have raised successful children as single women, I think it would help. But I think just growing up, you never really heard about single women raising successful children. It was always the family unit. But I think now in today’s time, there are so many single moms in the world.
There’s single moms by choice now. That’s becoming a whole movement. And we could talk about that later, but I think the biggest thing is just awareness. A lot of people are not shining a positive light on what’s happening with those children that grow up to be successful that are raised by single moms.
Tori Dunlap:
Right. Well, and I think it’s over 90% of single parents are single moms. So it is this feeling that it’s not single fathers are bad, it’s specifically single mothers are bad for society.
Kim Williams:
Single mothers.
Tori Dunlap:
Right. Right.
Kim Williams:
Yeah. They have nothing to say about the single fathers.
Tori Dunlap:
Oh, no. Nothing. If anything, it’s applause.
Kim Williams:
It’s just like they are perfect.
Tori Dunlap:
Can we talk about the single moms by choice?
Kim Williams:
We can. We can talk about it.
Tori Dunlap:
The first person to pop in my head is Mindy Kaling. That’s who I think of. That was a story for me that I think was really, really great and impactful, especially as her being a woman of color as like, yeah, I want children. I’m not going to wait for a man, or I’m not going to do this with somebody else. Do you feel like these stories are getting discussed more? And what are your opinions on how we talk about single motherhood by choice?
Kim Williams:
Yeah, so it is becoming more and more popular. I think when I first started my community, I didn’t really see a lot of it. And then I came across this one mom. I don’t know if she started following me first or how we connected, but she was sharing that she was almost 30, or maybe she was over 30, I can’t remember. She had dated so many guys and she really wanted to be a mom, but she knew her biological clock was ticking and she had no prospects in sight.
And she didn’t want to put her dream of becoming a mom on hold until she went the donor insemination route. And to that I say if you are financially capable, if you have the support system that you need, I’m not against anybody doing what they desire. But I think on the flip side of that, the average person is not really able to do that, and I would not recommend somebody just going out there and having a kid.
Single motherhood looks like, okay, it could be easy, or I can do this on my own, but nobody really talks about the emotional strain, the financial strain, what you go through mentally, especially if you have a limited support system. I just don’t think we talk about that enough. And so again, my opinion is that if you have all the resources and tools available to you, be my guest.
But then also I think about too how that impacts the kid. And so I don’t think there’s a lot of studies on how do you explain that to a kid when they’re at the age where they want to know who their dad is? Do you explain that? And some dads sign off saying they don’t want to be contacted, and they’ve donated their sperm to all of these banks. So it just gets really, I don’t know, murky.
I mean, I’m not against it. Personally, I wouldn’t do it because you asked for my opinion and since I’ve lived through single motherhood, but I think it’s definitely becoming more popular now.
Tori Dunlap:
Well, and I mentioned Mindy Kaling, who has a ton of financial privilege, right?
Kim Williams:
Right. Right.
Tori Dunlap:
She can afford child care. It makes a lot more sense.
Kim Williams:
Yeah. Yeah.
Tori Dunlap:
Do you feel like there is a stigma or maybe an exclusion because someone chooses to single parents as opposed to… If someone is making an active choice of, “Nope, I’m going to do this on my own,” does that hold its own stigma?
Kim Williams:
To be honest, I think society does categorize single moms. Although I do not do that personally in my community, I know that it’s being done. So for example, if you co-parent, they say you’re not a single mom because you have help. If you decided to do this on your own, you don’t really know what it’s like because you didn’t have to struggle. So there’s just a lot of things that people say about it, and you maybe look differently because of the route you became a single mom.
But again, in my community, I don’t try to categorize it. I’m like, we’re all in this together. We’re all trying to raise kids on our own, whether you have a dad that helps out 50% of the time or 10% of the time or 0% of the time. It’s just like we’re all here on this journey together and we connect in more ways than one. So it’s okay. I don’t try to make anybody feel less than or more than just because of how they got to the journey.
Tori Dunlap:
Right. One of the parts of your story I think is really fascinating is that you picked up and moved a lot. You moved from Mississippi to Houston and then Arizona. What precipitated that move or those moves for you? Can you share what this process looks like? Because moving is fucking expensive.
Kim Williams:
It is.
Tori Dunlap:
Is there anything you did during this time to make that transition financially easier for yourself and for your family?
Kim Williams:
No. So this was back during the time where I was in my early 20s. I had my daughter at 21, and so shortly after I turned 22. And so her dad and I, we were trying to work it out, but honestly, we were two kids with no tools and resources around relationships. And so in my mind, I grew up working at an early age, and so I was like, I’m not going to be with a man who is not going to work as hard as me.
So I was working two jobs. Her dad was working one. He was going on to finish his master’s. We were both in college when I got pregnant, by the way. So I decided that I would end the relationship, and only if he was to do things differently would I get back with him. If that didn’t happen, I would leave. So I think maybe I gave it three to six months. Things did not get better.
And so I had some family living in Houston, Texas, and they told me that they thought that I could do so much better and they would help me out with my daughter. And so although I didn’t know that family very well, it was just like that looks like a ticket out and a ticket to a better life. And so I didn’t act on that thought right away. It was probably almost a year before I decided, okay, you know what?
Things are not improving. I don’t have anything to lose here. At that time, I was in a one bedroom apartment. It was low income housing. It sucked, but I was just like I had a bed, a small little probably dining table. I didn’t have a lot, okay? And so I either sold what I had or gave things away just to get some money. I rented a SUV. I put in what I had, and I drove to Houston.
I did have a car at the time, but I left it behind because it was raggedy. And I just started my life over, to be honest. I lived with that family about six or seven months, and then I got my own apartment. And I struggled for probably two or three years until I felt like I was on my feet. And then I started to build community and all of those things. So the second move was because I graduated with my MBA and I was like, I need a return on my investment.
They say you go to school, you get this degree, and then you automatically get paid more. But that’s not happening because I’m doing all these interviews and people are telling me I don’t have leadership experience. And I’m just like, I just got this MBA. So I said, you know what? I’m not going to limit myself here staying in Houston. I’m just going to apply wherever there’s an opportunity and whoever allows me that opportunity.
I’m just going to move. And that is what I did. Long story short, I got an offer here in Arizona and I took it. I negotiated and I was well on my way. And I’m like, if I go back to Houston one day, that’s fine. If I go somewhere else, that’s fine too. I’m not limited to one place. Again, there I was just like, I don’t have anything to lose. I didn’t have really any family outside of that family that I had. Some things happened. We really didn’t have a good relationship anymore.
So again, besides the community that I built there, which I felt like I could always reach back out and connect to should I need it, I didn’t have anything to lose. I’m sorry. You asked me about financially how did I prepare? So the first move, I didn’t prepare obviously. I told you I sold my stuff. I didn’t have really any money in the bank, maybe 100 or $200. But the second time I moved, the company paid for the relocation, so I was able to move fairly quickly.
Tori Dunlap:
Was that something you negotiated or was that just part of the benefits package?
Kim Williams:
I asked for it.
Tori Dunlap:
Yeah, there you go.
Kim Williams:
I don’t know if it was going to be initially included, but I was just like, can you pay for relocation? And they gave me I think up to $4,000. So I didn’t even spend the whole 4,000 because I didn’t have a lot of stuff, but they had me to use a moving company. They came and picked up my stuff from my apartment, and then I shoot my car. And that was pretty much it. And I took a flight and they paid for that too, me and my daughter.
Tori Dunlap:
That’s great. Obviously in your work you work with single Black mothers, giving them resources to make more money, get more money. What are some unique situations for single mothers that we probably don’t think about? And in your opinion, what’s the best job for a single mother?
Kim Williams:
Oh, that’s an interesting question. So things that we don’t think about that come up is especially the PTO, I think. Because when the kids get sick, we are the ones caring for them. And so what I found is that a lot of moms will not take time off for themselves because they’re trying to save time for the kids. So I think if you can find an employer that is flexible with time off or allows you to make up time if you’re not salaried and they can understand what it’s like to be not just a single mom, but a working mom.
Even in I think marriages and partnerships, the moms usually take on the load of taking care of the sick kids. So I think that’s a really big thing, especially for single moms. And so I’d say the best job for them would probably be something if they can work remote. I worked remote before going back to the office or hybrid. I think that’s good because you don’t really have to take off time because you’re at home. And then usually remote jobs are more flexible.
I don’t know if there’s a specific title that you want to talk about as far as the best type of role for them, but I think just remote work in general is better. Now, I do know some moms that work in tech. And I think depending on the role, sometimes those can be more stressful because of the workload. But yeah, I just say when you’re going through your interviews, really ask about the workload, see if there’s anybody on the team you can talk to. Just really interview the companies like they’re interviewing you.
It’s really important I think that we take the time to interview the companies we’re going to be working for. I asked a lot of questions before I moved here. Even when I came to do my site visit, I met with some people in the C-suite and I got to ask real questions, even down to race and diversity, equity, and inclusion. What does that all look like? So it’s not just about the PTO, but I think too, if you’re a single Black mom, that also plays a role in that as well.
Tori Dunlap:
In terms of specifics, what are resources out there for single moms? And if somebody is listening who’s a single mother, where can she turn? What helped you? Where to go?
Kim Williams:
I always encourage people to go to Emma’s… I think she goes by the Wealthy Single Mommy. I think that she houses a lot of great resources in one place, but what helped me was just really finding people that were doing what I was doing. There’s no one specific thing. There’s no one specific agency that I used. It’s just being open to the tools and resources that are available to you. And how you find them is just Google. I think that’s what I did a lot of.
I wasn’t like, can you please tell me what resource I can use or go to? But I do know the Salvation Army is very helpful in providing resources and things like that. I actually worked for them at one point. And then what are some other… I know there’s a working mom website that has a lot of resources for jobs. I can’t think of these off the top of my head. I will have to get you a list. Would that be okay for the show notes?
Tori Dunlap:
Yeah, and we can link those down below.
Kim Williams:
Okay. Because I’m like, this is…
Tori Dunlap:
It happens to me too.
Kim Williams:
I wish I would’ve put together a list for you.
Tori Dunlap:
No, it happens to me too. When somebody asks, “What financial books do you recommend,” and I have a list of 30. And then of course, whenever somebody asks me, I’m like, “Mine? This other one and this other one.” I’m like, that’s what I got. And I’m like, I know there’s more than that.
Kim Williams:
Now, if you did ask me for books, I could tell you the top two would be Emma. Emma is also an author, right?
Tori Dunlap:
Yeah, I know Emma. Kristen also just told me The Mom Project. Is that what it’s called?
Kim Williams:
That’s it. That’s it.
Tori Dunlap:
There we go. Atta girl, Kristen. Thank you.
Kim Williams:
A lot of moms recommend that. I haven’t personally used it, but I know I can attest to it from them. But Kumiko I think is her name. She goes by The Budget Mom on Instagram. Her book is so simple for those moms who are out there and they are trying to get their money together. It’s so good. And she has a lot of free resources on her website for moms that are trying to get their money together.
So those two books by Emma, I can’t think of it. I think it’s called The Kickass Single Mom or something like that. I know she has two. I have them both, but those are good. I don’t really know any other single mom authors like that, honestly. And then Kumiko is no longer single. She got married. So if you want inspiration too, there you go.
Tori Dunlap:
What can we actually do, myself and people listening, to help single mothers or single mom friends? What can we do?
Kim Williams:
I think the biggest thing, if we can all figure out some way to help with childcare, I think that’s the biggest issue. But on a smaller scale, if you have any single mom friends or you have any single moms in your community, volunteer to keep the kids for a day or a few hours. Moms do not asking for help, especially single moms.
And so if you can do that for them to where they can just sit in silence for an hour or two where they can go and do some things that they haven’t had a chance get to do, I think that just goes a long way. The help is the biggest thing. When I talk to my community about what are their struggles, I think the three biggest things are money, support, and time. They don’t have a lot of time.
They don’t have a lot of support and community, or they’re afraid to ask because of fear of being turned down, and then they don’t have a lot of financial resources. So those are the biggest things. If we could figure out how to help them increase their income, I think that’s huge. And then like I said, just being there, the support. Even if you have any resources that you don’t think they’ve had time to look up, share that with them. Even just the resources go a long way also.
Tori Dunlap:
I think the one thing that I am more and more conscious of as a child free person is just asking my friends who are moms how they’re doing. And I even know I can be better at it, but just offering them space of, what do you need? Do you need me to do a school pickup? Do you need me to send you food? Do you need to just talk? Just checking in.
This is my own personal thing that I guess I’ll work out in therapy at some point, but there is a certain difference. And my friends who have had children, it’s just such a different world than the world I’m in. And I often don’t know how to interact in that world because it’s so different than my life. And so I’m trying to actively fight the impulse and still reach out and still have conversations with them because I know how important that is.
Kim Williams:
And I think even going a step further, instead of saying, “Well, how can I help you,” just ask, can you send them food? Can you take the kids to school?
Tori Dunlap:
Right. Right. That’s right.
Kim Williams:
Because again, I go back to that thing of they don’t really asking for help. They think that they have to do it all when there’s somebody like you that can’t support them. So just offering that. I think someone offered one day to send me food and I was like, oh my gosh, that was the sweetest thing. That really made my day.
But it was that little small thing because I knew I would be working all day and I would have to take time away from doing the tasks that I needed to do just to go and get food for me and my daughter. And so that simple thing of them saying they wanted to send me food was so sweet to me and it just really made my day. And it was small.
Tori Dunlap:
Literally going to send one of my friends food right now.
Kim Williams:
Oh, I love that.
Tori Dunlap:
No, that’s really… And I appreciate you saying that. No, but I appreciate you saying that because one of the things that drives me crazy is when men in my life will be like, “Well, what do you need?” It’s better than I guess not asking at all, but it is like, I need you to anticipate what I need because then I have to figure out in this moment, what does that support look like? And of course, I’m going to be like, “No, you don’t have to do anything. I’m fine.” So yeah, I appreciate you saying that.
Kim Williams:
Because you know what moms need, right?
Tori Dunlap:
Right. Right. Right.
Kim Williams:
They need food to feed themselves and the kids. They need time alone. There are just some things…
Tori Dunlap:
They need a spa day.
Kim Williams:
They need a spa day. Send a gift card or book the spa for them. Tell them you booked them. Because if you’re their friend, you pretty much would know their schedule. Or you can ask, “Hey, what days do you have available.” Even though it might be none or they already have things planned, but at least it’s really the thought I think that counts and you going a step beyond the thought and saying, “Let me do this for you.”
Tori Dunlap:
Totally. So in addition to individual support of spa days and sending food, we talked about this before, but you said I think that one of the biggest struggles was just this lack of community. If you are a single mama there, how do you get a community? How do you find a community? How do you actually find support in this very difficult place to be in as someone who’s just trying to figure it out by themselves?
Kim Williams:
So I think back when I was building my community, it was a bit harder. I feel like there are a lot more resources now, but I just started off, of course, with the podcast and building the Instagram community. But now what I recommend moms in my community even to do is to connect with moms. If their kids are doing extracurricular activities, if they go to church, there’s usually moms there.
Online, Instagram, you’d be surprised if you do follow a single mom page how much you have in common with another single mom that you could DM. I try to do these check ins often where I tell moms to comment what city and state they live in. And then if there’s another mom in their same city, they can DM them.
But if you’re on Facebook, there’s a lot of single mom groups on Facebook, and a lot of them might not be the most productive, but you can find some decent people in those groups. And then to go a step further, there are local city mom groups in your area. They may not be single mom groups, but they’re still mom groups. I think there was this one group, Black Moms of Houston, that I joined, and I met some moms in that group.
And even if they’re not single moms, they are still moms and they will still be able to be a support system for you and they will still help you. I like this quote by Patrice Washington, and she says that there’s always someone out there that has the power to bless you. And maybe that’s not exactly how she quotes it, but I truly believe that there are strangers out there that want to help you if you allow them to and if you open up yourself to meet people.
So outside of social media, there’s also Meetup.com, like that is still a thing. And they do have meetup groups around your interest. So you’d be surprised that you can meet moms also in those groups as well. So quite a few different ways to make mom friends or meet single moms or moms in general. But I definitely think that isolation is not good. I know our natural instinct is to isolate.
And especially as single moms, we feel like we have to do it all on our own, but we don’t have to do that. And there’s so many people out there that are going through what you’re going through and they also are looking for other people that can relate, or there’s somebody that has gotten over that stage where you are and they can show you and tell you how to get out of that. So you just have to open your mind and be willing to put yourself out there, and I truly believe that you will not regret that.
Tori Dunlap:
I just 100% agree. And I will also say slightly different situation, but I have realized I haven’t had a lot of in-person community, especially post-pandemic. A lot of my friends have moved away and live in different cities. Our whole business is virtual and I see our team every day, but it’s not the same. And so I realized I was lacking our in-person community.
And literally this person that I saw at barre classes that I was going to just looked really kind and fun and we had had a couple social interactions, but nothing crazy. It’s kind of scary. It’s asking somebody on a date, but I reached out to her on Instagram and I was just like, “Hi. You just seem like a really good person and have really good energy, and I’ve been trying to find more in-person community. Would you like to get coffee?”
And she was like, “Oh my gosh, yes, I would. I don’t have a lot of community either.” We’ve become immediate friends. Shout out to Julia. Julia and I are so close now, and we’ve really only known each other for two months. And it’s just like if you are that person out there who’s seeming like, “I can’t reach out to people, that’s terrifying,” I promise, just a little bit of vulnerability. It’s like asking somebody on a date.
I promise you, women are really generous and really kind. If you are that person, single mom or not, who just needs more community, just… That person that you admire, that person that you saw at that thing once, get coffee. Go and have dinner. Invite them over. It’s a scary thing to do, but it was so great to have that in my personal experience. I want all women to have that community, even if it seems scary to approach somebody to ask.
Kim Williams:
I’ll tell you a funny story about me moving here. So right now I’m currently living in a mountain town. It’s predominantly white. When I looked at the stats, I think there was 0.01% African American people here.
Tori Dunlap:
Oh wow! Wow!
Kim Williams:
I went looking on Instagram because I was like, there has to be at least one Black mom there. So I went down this rabbit hole of looking at all the local businesses and things, using the hashtags for the city, so that’s another way, hashtag city moms, whatever city you live in, moms. You might be able to find some moms that way. But I found this one Black mom. She had ended up doing a photo shoot, personal brand and photo shoot, with a local photographer. And so I DMed her on Instagram.
I had no clue if she was going to respond or not. And I told her, I was like, “Hey, I’m thinking about accepting a job there and was really looking to connect and see if you’d be open to sharing more about the town, how you like it,” so on and so forth. And so she responded back probably a few hours later and we’ve been connected ever since. And so when I got here, she offered to watch my daughter, a stranger from the internet, because I had to do the site visit because I wasn’t sure how I was going to work that out.
Because my daughter at that time was like eight, so I wasn’t going to leave her in the car by herself. And again, I told y’all earlier, learning how to depend on strangers for support because how else would I have done that without this person that I met on Instagram? And so she just happened to have two kids of her own. She had a husband at the time, crazy because now she’s about to go through her own process of not being married anymore. And at that time, we didn’t know that was going to happen, but now she’s seen me live my life as a single mom.
And so it’s just crazy how things come full circle. But just, again, being open to sending that DM I think can really be a game changer for anybody.
Tori Dunlap:
Totally. Where can people learn more about you and your work and your community?
Kim Williams:
Yeah, so you can find me on Instagram @singleblackmotherhood, and then you can check out the website, singleblackmotherhood.com. Everything is there.
Tori Dunlap:
Amazing. Kim, thank you for your time. We so appreciate you coming on and thank you for your work.
Kim Williams:
Thank you so much for having me. I appreciate it.
Tori Dunlap:
Thank you so much to Kim for joining us for this episode. You can go to singleblackmotherhood.com to learn more about her work and to join the Single Mom Collective. As always, the best way to support our show is by subscribing, by sharing with friends, and by rating the review, rating the review, by rating the podcast five stars. You think I would’ve done this enough times by now to know what’s going on, but just support the show if you like it. We appreciate it. This is free for you, but expensive for us.
And so you supporting the show allows us to continue getting great guests and producing great episodes, and we appreciate it. If you’re wondering where to get started on your financial journey, you can go to herfirst100k.com/quiz. Take our six step quiz. There’s no pass or fail. It’s just giving us a little bit more information about where you’re at in your financial journey, and then we give you personalized resources to progress. So herfirst100k.com/quiz if you’re wondering where to get started. Thank you so much for being here on Financial Feminist. I’ll see you next week. Talk to you soon.
Thank you for listening to Financial Feminist, a Her First $100k Podcast. Financial Feminist is hosted by me, Tori Dunlap, produced by Kristen Fields, associate producer Tamisha Grant, research by Ariel Johnson, audio and video engineering by Alyssa Medcalf, marketing and operations by Karina Patel, Amanda Leffew, Elizabeth McCumber, Masha Bakhmetyeva, Taylor Chou, Kailyn Sprinkle, Sasha Bonar, Claire Kurronen, Daryl Ann Ingram, and Jenell Riesner, promotional graphics by Mary Stratton, photography by Sarah Wolfe, and theme music by Jonah Cohen Sound.
A huge thanks to the entire Her First $100k team and community for supporting this show. For more information about Financial Feminist, Her First $100k, our guests, and episode show notes, visit financialfeministpodcast.com.
Tori Dunlap
Tori Dunlap is an internationally-recognized money and career expert. After saving $100,000 at age 25, Tori quit her corporate job in marketing and founded Her First $100K to fight financial inequality by giving women actionable resources to better their money. She has helped over one million women negotiate salary, pay off debt, build savings, and invest.
Tori’s work has been featured on Good Morning America, the New York Times, BBC, TIME, PEOPLE, CNN, New York Magazine, Forbes, CNBC, BuzzFeed, and more.
With a dedicated following of almost 250,000 on Instagram and more than 1.6 million on TikTok —and multiple instances of her story going viral—Tori’s unique take on financial advice has made her the go-to voice for ambitious millennial women. CNBC called Tori “the voice of financial confidence for women.”
An honors graduate of the University of Portland, Tori currently lives in Seattle, where she enjoys eating fried chicken, going to barre classes, and attempting to naturally work John Mulaney bits into conversation.
