In this episode of the Financial Feminist, we’re answering more user submitted questions, but this time we have TWO money experts giving you perspective — host Tori Dunlap and New York Times Bestselling Author, Tiffany “The Budgetnista” Aliche! Together they tackle these questions and more, offering valuable insights into personal finance.
“Should I increase my credit limit even though I don’t want to use the extra credit & will it affect my credit score?”
“I’m in college — how can I set myself up for financial success when I graduate?”
“Should I prioritize real estate investments over a traditional retirement account?”
If you’ve ever wanted to know the answers to these questions and more, get your notepad ready because Tori and Tiffany are answering questions from the Financial Feminist community — from budgeting hacks and saving money on groceries to understanding investment options like Roth IRAs and real estate.
You’ll also hear Tiffany’s answers to the following questions during our rapid-fire Q&A:
- Is it better to buy a used car with cash or a newer car with a payment?
- Is there a thing as having too many credit cards?
- What if your income is too high for a Roth IRA?
- What’s your weirdest budgeting hack?
- What does financial wholeness mean to you?
For the chance to get your questions answered in our next edition of “Ask Tori Anything,” and to stay up to date on our other events, make sure you subscribe to our weekly newsletter for the latest Her First $100K news.
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Meet Tiffany
Tiffany “The Budgetnista” Aliche is America’s favorite personal financial educator and author of the New York Times Best Seller, Get Good with Money. Through her Live Richer Movement, she’s helped over two million women save, manage, and pay off hundreds of millions of dollars.
A former teacher for ten years with a Master’s degree in Education, Tiffany was instrumental in getting The Budgetnista Law (A1414) passed in January 2019, making financial education mandatory for middle school students in New Jersey.
The Budgetnista is an NAACP nominee and the first Black woman to grace the cover of Money Magazine (solo). She’s also the cohost of Webby Award winning podcast, Brown Ambition, and has been featured on Good Morning America, the TODAY show, PBS, TIME, The New York Times, The Wall Street Journal, Reuters, ESSENCE Magazine, FORBES, Fox Business, MSNBC, CNN. Tiffany is also featured as a financial advisor in a Netflix documentary “Get Smart with Money.”
Transcript:
Tiffany Aliche:
When I think about my business, when I think about anything that’s been successful, it has not been accidental. I figure out what I want. I figure out who already has what I want, I ask them, “Can you share some of those steps with me?” And then I do those steps to the best of my ability. And then I put the work in and they call it the law of detachment, which is like you are in charge of the input and you release yourself from what the output is because that’s not on you.
Tori Dunlap:
Hi, financial feminist. Welcome back to the show. Hello.
If you’re an older goodie, welcome back and if you’re new to the show, hi, I’m so excited to see you. Thanks for being here. Thanks for listening to our show.
We talk about how money affects women differently, and I fight the patriarchy by making you rich.
That’s enough intro for me. Let’s talk about our guest, three-time guest of Financial Feminist. She is our most popular guest, both in terms of how many times she’s been here, but also in terms of how many times you’ve all requested her.
Tiffany, my good friend and fellow finance expert who we have had on the show previously two times, returns to do a fun little Q&A, almost live coaching money episode where we listen to some voicemails and then get into our answers. So if you’ve ever wanted to be financially coached by both of us, it’s a fun little episode about starting a business, about how to win the credit card game, and even answer a very common question about investing versus real estate.
We also talk about Tiffany’s new workbook Made Whole. We joke that this is an ask TNT episode because we’re dynamite.
It’s my least favorite joke I’ve ever made.
Okay, let’s talk about Tiffany.
Tiffany The Budgetnista Aliche is America’s favorite personal finance educator and author of the New York Times Bestseller, Get Good With Money. Through her LIVE RICHER movement, she’s helped over two million women save, manage, and pay off hundreds of millions of dollars.
A former teacher of 10 years with a master’s degree in education, Tiffany was instrumental in getting the budget needs to law passed in January of 2019, making financial education mandatory for middle school students in New Jersey.
All right, team, we’re so excited for this episode and to have Tiffany back as always. Let’s go ahead and get into it.
But first a word from our sponsors.
Tiffany, welcome back to the show. I’m so excited you’re back.
Tiffany Aliche:
Thank you, Tori. I love being here. You know that girl.
Tori Dunlap:
We were joking. We’re TNT, Tiffany and Tori, TNT we’re dynamite together.
Tiffany Aliche:
Yes. Oh, yeah.
Tori Dunlap:
For those who may be new to the show or haven’t listened to the first two times you’ve been on, give us the really quick TLDR that you’ve answered a million times of who you are and what your work’s mission is.
Tiffany Aliche:
I’m a financial educator, New York Times bestselling author or whatever. Well, there’s both of us on here. Netflix star.
Tori Dunlap:
Star.
Tiffany Aliche:
Honestly, I’m a teacher turned financial educator that helps women, especially women of color, especially Black women, get and stay on financial track. And I’ve been doing it for 15 years and… Yeah.
Tori Dunlap:
What have you been up to since we chatted? I know you’ve traveled a ton.
Tiffany Aliche:
Yes.
Tori Dunlap:
You said last time you were here you’re like rich Auntie Era. Talk to me about that.
Tiffany Aliche:
Honestly, I bought a condo. I don’t know if I bought one when I…
Tori Dunlap:
Yeah. I think you talked about it. I think you were like, “I bought it all cash even though I probably wasn’t supposed to.”
Tiffany Aliche:
I know. I did it. I’m glad that I did.
Tori Dunlap:
Great.
Tiffany Aliche:
I am debt free and I had it, and so I’m renovating it now and I’m not doing it in budget needs compassion. We’re doing all the marbles and all the things which I love.
Tori Dunlap:
Fun.
Tiffany Aliche:
And I have just been… The last year, 2023, was actually a really rough year in business. It was slower than any year I’d had for a very, very long time. But there were some really great lessons and it actually made the team better and it made me a better leader. So I think you’re forged from the fire.
Tori Dunlap:
Yes.
Tiffany Aliche:
And so this year, it started off great so far, which is good.
And honestly, I am just excited about how life is unfolding, that what does it look like to incorporate other interests into my life. I want to do another children’s book. I want to do a new podcast that’s not about business or personal finance, just for fun. So I’m just exploring things that are hobbies. Anyone remember those? Hobbies?
Tori Dunlap:
Literally, I’ve had so many conversations with my partner and my friends in the last year or two where I’m like, “I don’t have hobbies. I don’t know what they are anymore. I don’t do anything for just fun, and that’s not how I want to live my life.”
Tiffany Aliche:
Yeah.
Tori Dunlap:
Yeah. I’m right there with you, girl.
Well, and this is a question we actually got. So we’re going to do some listener submitted questions. We have some questions from Instagram that people submitted. And one of them was actually very, very similar to what we’re talking about, which is did either one of us ever imagine writing a bestseller?
Tiffany Aliche:
I did actually.
Tori Dunlap:
Me too.
Tiffany Aliche:
Right? I know people want you to be like, “Man, not me. No, girl.”
Tori Dunlap:
Literally… Tiffany, I say this all the time, people will ask me, they’re like, “Did you ever imagine that this would be possible?” And the answer as a woman is you go, “Oh my God, no. This is beyond my wildest dreams. And I never thought…” And I’m like, “No, bitch. I knew I was capable of this.”
Tiffany Aliche:
Yes.
Tori Dunlap:
Yeah.
Tiffany Aliche:
Now, because you can’t decide the outcome, but we can decide the input.
Tori Dunlap:
Yeah.
Tiffany Aliche:
But there’s literally this a picture of me in 2010, I want to say, that my first book, which was self-published called The One Week Budget. I am at Barnes & Nobles. I put my book, because it’s self-published they didn’t have it. I put my books on the shelf under the personal finance sign, and I got dressed in the bathroom, my Sunday’s finest, and a friend of mine who was a budding photographer, we took all these pictures and I still had them with my book next to all the Susies and the Daves and we got in trouble because we were not allowed to do a photo shoot.
So literally, I’m laughing because as I look at that picture, I think to myself, the manager is behind my friend who’s taking pictures, yelling at us, and I’m like, I’m smiling, I’ll leave in a moment between poses.
And so when I put that picture side by side in my books Get Good With Money and my newest, the workbook version of it, Made Whole, are on the shelves legitimately.
And so yes, I saw it because I put myself in that position to be like, “One day my book will be here.” And it is.
And so I think that that is one of the fastest ways to get to the place where you want to be is to envision yourself and hopefully to go take pictures in that place and say, “I’ll be there too one day.”
Tori Dunlap:
Yeah. I would love to talk with you a little bit about even the word manifest because that’s what you’re doing and that’s what I do, and I think both of us are clearly very good at it, but I think one of the things that really the internet gets wrong about manifestation is we’re told, “Oh, it’s like listen to this audio frequency or comment, ‘I’m going to claim this,’ down below.” And that’s fine, but manifestation is doing the work and putting in the work to be able to carry out the goals that you have for yourself.
Tiffany Aliche:
Exactly. There’s no coincidence.
If I had not done everything possible… So all my friends that had New York Times bestsellers, I said, “What do you know about getting a New York Times bestseller?” And they were like, “Okay, you want to sell at least 10,000 books,” or “You want to make sure people buy them all over the country. You want to make sure you get good press.”
So there were a few things that I knew. So I said, “Well, then let me do those things to the extent that I could do them. How do I get my audience to buy as many books as possible?” I promoted to them. I had a brand new publicist who I was like, “These are the shows I need to be on.” And I let my audience know, “Wherever you live, around the country, around the world, purchase books ideally locally. So let’s support.”
So I did all that I could do, and you hope that if the rules are fair, I knew my numbers were enough, but I’ve known people who’ve had the numbers and they haven’t made the list. So that part is not my control, but I knew that I had checked off all the boxes that I knew. So you have to do the work in all things.
When I think about my business, when I think about anything that’s been successful, it has not been accidental, I figure out what I want, I figure out who already has what I want, I ask them, “Can you share some of those steps with me?” And then I do those steps to the best of my ability. And then I put the work in, and they call it the law of detachment, which is like you are in charge of the input and you release yourself from what the output is because that’s not on you.
Tori Dunlap:
Right. And I always want to highlight to your credit, as the true community builder you are, the moment you knew the formula for New York Times bestseller, I got a phone call, “Here’s how you do it. Here’s how you replicate.” And just so much credit to you. You practice what you preach. It’s so helpful.
Tiffany Aliche:
Thank you.
Tori Dunlap:
But I completely agree. I think there’s two ways I think people get goals wrong is, one, they just go, “I want this thing.” And then they never actually make a plan to achieve it, whether that’s personal finance or something else, right?
“Oh, I want to be a New York Times bestseller someday.” Okay, well, what are you doing to actually get yourself there? Because the road from never writing anything to New York Times bestseller is a long one and requires a lot of steps. So I think that’s one thing is, I say this in my book, a goal without a plan is just a wish. You have to have an actual plan to get there.
And then I think the second thing is just when you’re progressing towards that goal, whether again, debt free, New York Times bestseller, building a business, I think it’s just so easy to get these roadblocks and think, “Oh, this is impossible. I don’t want to do this.” And you and I of course have hit multiple, dozens, hundreds of those roadblocks of things telling us, “Oh, you can’t do it.” And it’s like, “No, I believe I can. I know I can. I’ve already got it, so let’s go out and get it.”
Tiffany Aliche:
Yeah. No, it’s true.
And also too, I think that you touched on something that, and because you’ve texted me, you were doing something really successful on social where you were using this automated system, and I was like, “Oh, this is great.”
Tori Dunlap:
We still are. It’s going great for us.
Tiffany Aliche:
Right? Then so Tori saw that… I think I had commented in your comments, and right away you text me, you’re like, “Girl, do you want me to hook you up with the person who helped me? Do…”
I love that. Because also part of it is to me the fastest way through success is usually through other people. It’s like why should you figure out something if I know. Let me share what I’ve learned. At any moment, Tori’s going to know something that I don’t know and you’re willing to share. In any moment, I am going to know something that you might not know and I’m willing to share.
And also it’s important to build community in the community and then reach out and ask for help, but also to be of help to the community.
Tori Dunlap:
Yeah.
Tiffany Aliche:
Yeah.
Tori Dunlap:
And I’ll say as one last point to this question, if I ever pictured myself as a bestseller, yes, but not for a fucking personal finance book. That was not part of my plan. I literally wrote… And we’ve talked about this in our marketing, I wrote when I was seven or eight, I want to write a book someday. And for me, I was just obsessed with reading and writing and thought it was going to be like a novel because that’s all of the things I was reading.
And so I think that’s the other thing with goals is that they can shape and shift as you grow older because of course, 8-year-old me wasn’t reading the books that you’re writing now, but didn’t know, “Oh, a personal finance expert is a career out there that’s a potential possibility for you.”
So your goals should and could ebb and flow and change as you get older and you have more information and your circumstances change.
Tiffany Aliche:
Exactly.
Tori Dunlap:
I love that question. Let’s go to our next one, which is also related to growing a business. Tiffany, how did you know it was time to quit your job and take your business full time?
Tiffany Aliche:
So my job closed down, I didn’t. Some of us don’t have choices.
So it was the recession and it was a daycare center where I was working. I was a teacher, and although I had my master’s in education, I really loved working with the little ones. They were nonprofit based. They lost their funding. So it was the summertime. Three days before school was supposed to open back up, they said, “Hey, we never got our funding,” and so there’s just no school. And I was like, “Wait, forever?”
And so I had started The Budgetnista in 2007, ’08. I was doing it as volunteer work. I was bored teaching, I love teaching, but after a while it gets to be really easy. And plus, I taught preschool, so their kids were napping for an hour or two every day. And I’m like… Well, in that time, I was like, “Oh, well what else would I do? I love financial education.”
And so I started to create what I thought was going to be a nonprofit because I’m like, “I teach, I’ll create this nonprofit while I donate my time to teach financial education in my community.”
And so as I was building that, I wrote my first little book, One Week Budget.
Well, let me not say little because women always do that. No.
I wrote my first book, it was self-published The One Week Budget while the kids slept.
And so it wasn’t until I lost my job that I was looking for a new job, but it was the new school year, so they weren’t hiring because you have to have your teachers before the school year starts. And it was then that my friend was like, “Well, you’ve been helping people with their money. What if you started to charge for that?” And I was like, “Can I do that?” And so that’s really what it was.
I’m actually pretty risk averse, not as much now, but that Tiffany then was very risk averse, but it was such a blessing to lose such a safe job because it literally rewired my brain about what safety looked like. It was like actually a job is not safe. Betting on you is safe because at least you know what’s happening. And so that’s how it happened for me.
Tori Dunlap:
I just want to call out what you just said, betting on you is safe, because I think we are told as women all of the time to not trust yourself, to not trust your own instincts, to always pick the stable option.
And I’ve told the story before, but I wasn’t laid off or my job didn’t end. But it was a very similar thing where as my business was getting more success, it was very clear that it was time for me to leave even internally at the company. Things were just getting bad and it was very obvious that it was time to go.
But because I had parents who were always picking the stable choice, which I was thankful for, I grew up feeling like entrepreneurship is a risk, going full time is a risk. And I had my parents calling me and saying, “You need to keep your job. You need to do everything you can to keep your job.” And of course, now tomorrow my dad’s flying out to tour the New York Stock Exchange with me. So-
Tiffany Aliche:
I love that for you.
Tori Dunlap:
I know. I get to call them every once in a while when I’m feeling a little petty and be like, “Remember that advice and how terrible it was.” But because they had always chosen the stable choice, which was stable paycheck, 401k, health insurance, and that felt like such a risk to me, even though it wasn’t.
So actually, I was at an event last night and got asked a similar question, and I would love your take on this.
I think there’s two kinds of entrepreneurs or potential entrepreneurs. I think one of them is the okay, before I quit, I need to have every duck in a row, I need to have the safety net, and then the safety net for the safety net, and then the backup, backup, backup safety net. And that’s very much me, which was like, “Okay, I’m going to grow my business. I’m going to get it to a point where it’s already making money, it has momentum. I have a 100K in the bank, my 100K at 25.” That was the permission slip I needed to quit my job. And only then, and even really with a huge asterisk, I don’t know if I ever felt 100% comfortable, but it was like, “Okay, I needed to completely feel prepped and ready to do it.”
I think there’s the second kind of entrepreneur that’s fling themselves off the cliff and figure it out on the way down. That desperate energy actually works for them because it’s sink or swim. It’s like, “I either figure this out and I figure out the parachute or I fall flat on my face.” I don’t know. Does that ring true for you?
Tiffany Aliche:
Yeah, I think so.
I’m definitely not a fling myself off of… I’m a nervous Nelly. Ideally, I wouldn’t have left teaching if I had the choice because unless I had all my ducks in a row.
But now I feel like because I’m more confident in my abilities that I’m more of a hybrid because I certainly will try something new as long as I have a little bit of reserves. I’m like, “You know what? Let’s try this thing. It might not work, but you know what? We’ve got a few months’ worth of savings. Let’s just see how this goes.”
And so I think over time, as you grow your confidence, you can adopt more risk because risk looks different when you are more prepared in the broader sense.
So I’m not the same Tiffany from 15 years ago. I’ve got better relationships, I’ve got additional knowledge, I know how to make money, and so I can take a more calculated risk than I could before where it’s literally a risk risk.
Tori Dunlap:
Well, and that trust in yourself is huge.
I remember thinking, “Oh, if I’m getting this much done, and this is just a side hustle, imagine the possibility of if I’m all in.” Just from a time standpoint like, “Wow. I get to not have to work 40 hours a week for somebody else. I get to take that time and work for myself, and it’s already going this well? Well, imagine what happens if I have much more time, much more resources, much more energy.”
Tiffany Aliche:
Yes. One of the things I’ll say that I love about having a business is it grows you up so much.
Tori Dunlap:
God, yes.
Tiffany Aliche:
Right? I’m not going to lie. You ever get off the phone, you’re like, “I’m a bad bitch.” You ever get off the phone. You know you rock the thing.
Tori Dunlap:
Often. Yes.
Tiffany Aliche:
… you’re like, “Yo, look at me.”
Tori Dunlap:
I’m like, “Nobody does this shit better than I do.”
Tiffany Aliche:
And the thing is I was highly insecure in high school like so many of us were. I was, how can I be as small? How can I shrink? Just because I didn’t have the confidence in myself. So many teenagers don’t.
But entrepreneurship… My therapist calls it corrective experiences, which is you tell yourself I’m not a good speaker, but then you speak and you do well, and you’re like, “Wait, that’s not true. Oh.” That experience corrected your thinking.
And so I used to tell myself, “I’m not decisive.” And I’m like, “Really, girl? Because you make decisions all day.” So I’m like, “Oh…” My brain’s like, “Actually, let’s re-correct that experience because that’s not true.”
Tori Dunlap:
The rewiring.
Tiffany Aliche:
Yes.
Tori Dunlap:
Yeah.
Tiffany Aliche:
And so entrepreneurship has all these things I would tell myself about myself, or maybe the world has told me about me like, “Oh, as a woman, you’re not able. As a woman of color, this is that.” All that is like, “Yeah, it’s a lie because I’m out here doing it.”
Even for me, there were lies I told myself, “if I’m on the cover of my book, it won’t sell.”
Tori Dunlap:
I remember talking… I think the first time you came on the show. I remember… It just broke my heart.
Tiffany Aliche:
Yes. I can’t be on the cover of a money book. Well, 260,000 books later.
Tori Dunlap:
“Yes, I can.”
Tiffany Aliche:
I corrected my own experience.
And so that is one of my favorite parts. It’s not for everyone, but one of my favorite parts of entrepreneurship is that it has grown me up in such a way and given me such confidence in my abilities by showing me I am capable and able of doing anything that I put my mind to.
Tori Dunlap:
Yep. Couldn’t agree more.
We have a voicemail that we’re going to go ahead and listen to. Somebody asking about a credit line increase.
Tiffany Aliche:
Okay.
Speaker 3:
Hi, Tori and Tiffany. I’m wondering about increasing the available credit on my Capital One card. So I have the Capital One Venture card for travel and for the points, and they keep sending me emails about reevaluating my income for a potential credit increase. And I’m not interested in using the increased credit, but I’ve been thinking more about is it worth getting that increased limit so that my ratio of credit usage goes down? If I use the credit card spending the same amount and I have a bigger limit, I’d have that smaller percentage of credit usage.
So my question is it worth the credit check that would happen in order to get that increased credit, or will they do a credit check for that? Thank you.
Tori Dunlap:
Double header. If you’re watching this on YouTube, you just watched Tiffany and I in exact… We were both nodding at the same part and like…
Tiffany Aliche:
Yes. I’m like, “Huh?” About the other part, yes. Yes.
Of course, I have to say, Tori, you have clearly done such a good job with educating your audience.
Tori Dunlap:
Oh, thanks.
Tiffany Aliche:
Because the question she asked and how she asked it lets me know that because people-
Tori Dunlap:
It’s a very educated question.
Tiffany Aliche:
I just love that. I was like, “Oh, this is an educated person.”
So one, yeah, I just say, well, kudos for understanding that yes there’s a huge benefit to being able to… If you have the discipline, not to spend more of increasing your limit, because 30% of your score is based upon your utilization. So how much you are using versus how much you could be using.
So, say, you have a credit card balance or a credit card limit of a hundred dollars, and right now you consistently keep $50 on that card, that’s a 50% utilization. That’s too high.
But let’s just say they want to double it from a hundred dollars limit to a $200 limit, now that same $50 is a 25% utilization. That is much, much, much better. And you will see a score increase. So that’s the first part that, yeah, so it’s great if they want to raise your credit limit.
Now, here’s the thing. Not all credit card companies need to check your credit to do so. So ask that question because if they’re already making you the offer, typically, they’re going to check your credit if you make the ask like, “Hey, I would love to raise my limit.” They might check your score. So ask, “Are you going to check my score in order to do so? Or is this something that you could just do based upon the way I’m navigating my card in such a healthy way?” Because this is an indicator that you pay, they feel safe with you, they’re willing to issue an additional line, increase your limit.
And so if they’re not going to check your score and you know, you trust yourself not to overspend, then go for it. And even if they are going to check your score, it might be offset by the fact that your utilization will go down, and so you’ll get those points back anyway as long as you’re not trying to buy a house or a car in a month or so.
Tori Dunlap:
Right. Yeah. Plus one, all of that.
And to your point, we don’t know the exact tradeoff. The credit bureaus are never telling us, “If you do this, it’ll increase your score this many points.” It’s way more veiled than that. So it’s hard to say, okay, if you do a credit check, but then your utilization goes down, what is that actually going to do. It depends on a lot of different factors, including what’s your credit score right now.
But if you can get a credit line increase without a credit check, hell yeah. Take it. Just don’t use it because it’ll boost your score.
Tiffany Aliche:
Yeah.
Tori Dunlap:
Cool. Great question. All right, next voicemail.
Speaker 4:
Hi, Tori and Tiffany. I’m a fellow Seattleite and also a student of finance, and I have been dying to ask this question ever since I became a part of Her First 100K community. What are your best tips and tricks for a student like myself to win the credit card race and navigate through student loans and things like that and still come out on top, maybe even graduating with that first 100K?
Tori Dunlap:
Oh, wow. This is a solve my entire financial life credit question.
Tiffany Aliche:
I was going to say, “Oh.” She said, “How do you do open heart surgery and go?”
Tori Dunlap:
Without anesthesia by the way.
Let me reinterpret this question maybe with something that we can answer, which is like, okay, if I am a student, if I’m in college, how do I set myself up financially the best that I can.
Tiffany Aliche:
So one, back in the day, back in my day, in order to establish credit, you would have to get a store card. Thank God, you don’t have to do that anymore.
You have to understand that there are different types of ways to borrow. There’s reoccurring, which are credit cards, and then there’s installment, which is your student loan.
So you already have your installment borrowing down because you have your student loans. So I would look for… You might have what they call a thin file. So you might not actually get approved for a regular credit card, which is fine. You can look for a secured card if you don’t get approved for a regular credit card.
And so a secured card is a card that’s secured with your money, sometimes two, $300. And then they say, “Here is your credit card with a $300 limit. So if you don’t pay us, we’re just going to take the money that we put up in a money market account or a savings account where we have secured your money.”
And then the key really is to win the game is to actually not use your card for real, for real. You’re going to do for fake. So you’re going to put your cheapest bill, your $9 gym membership, something reoccurring on that card, you’re going to leave that card at home, and then you’re going to have your checking account pay off that bill every month in full automatically.
And if you start that freshman year and you do that all the way to senior year, you’re going to have amazing credit because it’ll look like, “Oh my God, she pays off every single month.” And so your score is going to be awesome because bad credit leads to an expensive life, so your score is going to be awesome. You’re going to be able to get your first apartment more easily, you’re going to be able to get a car more easily. You’re going to be able to get so many things, it’ll cost you less because the interest rates will be better for you.
Now, I’m going to let Tori answer how do you save more money to get to your first 100K. I don’t know about that should be your aim by the time you graduate college. That’s not crazy, but to me, I’m focusing on, let me just focus on the credit part. But yeah, if you do that, you’ll have an amazing credit score and be able to borrow to your heart’s content as needed when you graduate college.
Tori Dunlap:
Yeah. Clearly, this person is incredibly ambitious, which we love.
Tiffany Aliche:
Yes.
Tori Dunlap:
I will say, “Slow your roll, girl.” Everybody told me this, and then I didn’t fucking listen, but when I was in college, everybody told me, “Enjoy these four years because you won’t get them back.” And then I’m like, “Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, no, I am. But also I’m stressed about a job.”
Truly, everything’s going to work out the way it’s going to work out. I know this is not financial advice, but isn’t it though? Take a deep breath. Truly just… It sounds like even that you’re thinking about this, you’re doing the things right already. So yes, exactly what Tiffany said is…
What I did unintentionally, which is like I just didn’t have a lot of money and I had my cute little discover card that I still own and just like, yeah, I would go out to eat twice with friends and could only eat appetizers, and that was what went on the credit card, and then I would just pay that off from my checking account. So yeah, that’s exactly right.
I would say focus in college. Your goal in college is to personally have the best time possible and make great friends and make great memories. Professionally, your job is to set yourself up for success. And that can mean…
For me, my senior year, it was going and having informational interviews with every single person I could possibly talk to. I made a secret goal with myself of like, “Okay, once a week you’re going to do a coffee or a 15-minute phone call with somebody whose career you admire or who works at a job you think you might want to do someday.” And that was a really great way for me to just start feeling like I was getting myself in a place to think about my career.
The other thing too is I attended any free event on campus that I felt like I could meet somebody, I could get some new information. There are so many incredible free things that your college puts on all of the time that you will never get to do again because when you’re a college student, that’s your ultimate card of, “I’m a college student. Can I have 15 minutes of your time?” Or “I’m going to go to this auditorium when I know this whole person will be there and I’ll pick their brain.” So I think take advantage of all of those opportunities.
And in terms of financially, if you can graduate college without going into debt because you were mentioning the student debt dance, if there’s any way you can get out of college debt free that is going to help you hit your 100K, that’s going to help with everything else. So whether that is merit scholarships.
One of my favorite tips that I wish more people talked about is departmental scholarships.
So when I went to college, I got two degrees. I got an organizational communication degree, which was marketing with less math. That was in the communication school. And then I got a theater degree and I got departmental specific scholarships.
I got a communication scholarship and I got a theater scholarship. And I actually had to audition for the theater scholarship before I entered university and I only knew that because I had done some digging. I had perused the website and figured out, “Oh, you can audition for this theater scholarship.”
And I think with communication scholarships, there wasn’t a lot that was offered, and it was more specific need based, but I think I got $500 a semester, which doesn’t sound like a lot, but that’s better than nothing.
Tiffany Aliche:
Yeah. That’s books.
Tori Dunlap:
Right, right.
So start figuring out… Again, if you can graduate college debt free, there’s scholarships and there’s some finagling you can do. And if you do have to take out loans, try not to do them from a private institution, try to do federal loans because those are going to be more flexible, and they’re also open to student loan forgiveness versus the private loans.
I don’t know. Tiffany, anything to add there?
Tiffany Aliche:
No, I love that.
And I think my favorite part is just use that I’m in college card as much as possible.
Tori Dunlap:
Yeah. Because you don’t know what you’d have until you don’t have it.
Tiffany Aliche:
Yes.
Tori Dunlap:
Yeah.
Tiffany Aliche:
People will sit down with you. They’ll give you the space and the grace and the, “Yes, I’d love to pour in.” “Yes, I’d love to have 15-minute…”
It’s different being 40 being like, “Can I pick your brain?” People are like, “No, girl.”
Tori Dunlap:
“Pay me. Pay me.”
Tiffany Aliche:
Yes.
So lean in, lean in, and lean in.
And good luck to you. You’re already on such a great path if you’re here listening to Tori.
Tori Dunlap:
I know. Even the fact you’re asking about this question, I’m like, “Oh, man, you’re fine. I am not worried about you. You’re fine.”
And I know because I’m the same way. Even me saying that to you, you’re going to be like, “No, I’m not fine.” You’re fine. You’re fine, you’re good. You’re doing all the right things.
All right. We got one last voicemail.
Mirania:
Hi, Tori. My name is Mirania. I’m a big fan of yours. I’m 22 years old, so trying to figure out how I should be budgeting, how I should be prioritizing my investing, and how I should be saving up for retirement, all that good stuff.
So along that vein, I wanted to ask you a question about investing in land/real estate. I have a friend who claims that instead of maxing out her retirement account, she is going to be buying land and just watching it appreciate in value faster and a lot more than it would be if it were just sitting in a 401k account.
So I wanted to ask you on your opinion on that. If I have the ability to, should I be investing in land as opposed to, I don’t know, putting that money into the stock market or putting that money into a retirement account?
Tori Dunlap:
Huh. Huh.
First of all, just… I don’t know. Kristen, we didn’t even plan this, but all of these are like 22-year-old ambitious as fuck. Props to everybody calling in today. That’s fucking incredible.
Tiffany, why does this remind me of your credit card scam?
Tiffany Aliche:
Yeah. I was going to say… She said, “My friend…” I’m like if you guys weren’t-
Tori Dunlap:
I know, I know. I’m like, “MLM? Is this [inaudible 00:31:52].”
Tiffany Aliche:
Well, I’ll say this. You get this question a lot like real estate or the market. I’m sure.
Tori Dunlap:
Both. Why not both?
Tiffany Aliche:
I was going to say both of them, BOF, both.
Because here’s the thing that typically what happens is that just like with anything, there’s a seesaw effect. When the market’s up, real estate is maybe not as strong. When real estate is strong, maybe the market’s not up. So maybe the question to ask yourself is where to start?
Because I did… I want to say my 401k, that traditional investing first, and now I had three properties. I just sold one. But later on in life, I started to invest into real estate, not heavy, just like if something comes up and it makes sense, I lean in.
And what I love is that I get to see certainly because I live in New Jersey and real estate appreciates much faster and on the coast than it does typically other places of the country. I have seen…
I bought my house that I live in now. It was a foreclosure. I bought it for 180 in 2017. It’s now worth 500,000. So that’s likely better than the market.
But there are places, and I’ve seen during the recession, I purchased a condo for $220,000 right before the recession and then ended up losing it because it depreciated down to 150.
So if all my money was in real estate and depending on the market, I could get rich or I could be broke.
And so I don’t like the idea of all your money ever being in one space. Period.
And so at 22, it is easier to get into 401k because your job probably offers it. You could do your 50 bucks a month or whatever than it is to jump feet first into real estate.
And so I would start simply, your 401k is right there. IRAs are right there. Then learn more about… Because what land are you going to buy, sis? Where? From where? Ohio? Would you…
Tori Dunlap:
Do you want to live there?
Tiffany Aliche:
[inaudible 00:33:51] research-
Tori Dunlap:
Sorry, anybody listening from Ohio. But I personally don’t want to live in Ohio. I’ve been to Ohio. It’s lovely. I’m like, “Hmm, no.” No.
Tiffany Aliche:
That’s the thing that… To me, real estate takes a little bit more money typically, and it takes a little more knowledge. So accumulate that first before you start jumping into that space.
But 401k doesn’t require as much knowledge as like, “here’s my hundred bucks. I want to put in a mutual fund that mirrors or ETF that mirrors the S&P 500.” You don’t need to know nearly as much. So that would be my suggestion.
Tori Dunlap:
And before people in Ohio get pissed, anybody who’s buying land in Ohio, you’re not buying it likely in Columbus or Cincinnati. You’re buying it in the middle of nowhere, right?
Tiffany Aliche:
Yeah.
Tori Dunlap:
Again, plus one, everything you just said.
I think also putting all of your eggs in one basket for anything is not good. Putting all of your money in a high yield savings account, not good. A high yield savings account is meant for short term goals. You also need to invest. Putting all of your money in investments and not having a high yield savings account for an emergency or something else, that’s not good.
Saying, “Okay, I’m 22 and I’m going to put all of my money in real estate,” especially, “and not doing my 401k,” that just makes me super, duper nervous.
If you want to buy land, great. But maybe I’m reading too much into it. It doesn’t sound like you want to. It sounds like your friend has told you this is what she’s doing, and it’s making you question everything, which is fine. If that’s something you actually want to do, great. Something to explore. But it’s not the, “I’m going to opt out of a 401k or opt out of other things so that I can do this.” I think that that’s potentially really damaging.
So yeah, first ask yourself, “Do I want to be a landowner or is this just something that somebody told me is a smart idea?”
I infamously do not own property. It works for me at this stage in my life. I’m 29.
Tiffany Aliche:
Exactly.
Tori Dunlap:
I’m getting to the point where the house itch is happening, but also land in Seattle… Land in Seattle is expensive, let alone a house, right?
Tiffany Aliche:
Yes.
Tori Dunlap:
So for me, it’s not on my radar right now because it doesn’t fit the stage in my life I’m in.
So actually ask yourself, “Do I want to own land? And if I’m using it as an investment…” It doesn’t have to be… This is not the only investment. You can literally invest in the stock market and then also potentially buy land or whatever else you want to do. But yeah, it sounds like this is, “I heard from a friend that this might be lucrative. Should I do it?” I’m like, “Who knows? Who knows?”
Tiffany Aliche:
Yeah. And there’s other ways to invest, right? Because you and I both have businesses. This is an investment as well.
Tori Dunlap:
100%.
Tiffany Aliche:
The number one investment is always yourself.
Tori Dunlap:
I’m just leaving that there. Preach.
Okay. All right, Tiffany, so we got a lightning round really quick, and I would love your take on these questions. You ready?
Tiffany Aliche:
Okay.
Tori Dunlap:
Okay.
Used car paid for in cash or nicer car with a payment?
Tiffany Aliche:
Used car paid for in cash.
Tori Dunlap:
I would agree. However, if you are at a place financially where you’re fine, and this is just a car that’s fun for you, great. Nice car with a payment.
It’s very similar to your house thing where you’re just like, “No, I’m just going to do the thing that might not be financially smart because it’s what I want to do.” Cool.
Is there such a thing as too many credit cards?
Tiffany Aliche:
Yes. If you’re using all of them and you are not paying them off, but if you’re responsible, then do you.
Tori Dunlap:
I got eight credit cards. I just don’t use them all.
Tiffany Aliche:
Exactly.
Tori Dunlap:
I’ve got three that I use. So yeah, the rest are in a drawer.
What if your income is too much for a Roth IRA?
Tiffany Aliche:
Girl, they call a backdoor Roth IRA. Go ahead and ask your financial advisor about that. Or it literally looks like rolling over money from one place to another through the back door. If you don’t know how to do it, you definitely don’t want to do it on your own, you typically have to work with a financial institution to do so.
Tori Dunlap:
Weirdest budgeting hack you’ve ever tried or weirdest way you’ve tried to save money?
Tiffany Aliche:
I’m trying to think of the weirdest way.
When I was really, really broke, I used to save foil, plastic baggies.
Tori Dunlap:
The little ketchup packets?
Tiffany Aliche:
Yes. I used to literally go to parties because I’m like, “Ooh, is there food involved?” Yes, cha ching for dinner. I don’t have to pay for it.
So yeah, I remember… Well, I think I would say not weirdest, but I used to bring a calculator with me to the grocery store, add up all of my food before I got to the cashier because I didn’t want to be embarrassed by not having enough money to have to put things back.
Tori Dunlap:
And this is pre calculator on an iPhone, right? So you actually brought a calculator with you?
Tiffany Aliche:
Yes, yes.
Tori Dunlap:
Yeah. I love that. That’s lovely.
I think mine, this is such a weird one, Alaska Airlines shout out, used to do, if you submitted surveys, they worked with a marketing company and then every survey you filled out you got 500 Alaska miles. And so on my commute to work on the light rail, I would just sit there and they’d be like-
Tiffany Aliche:
That’s reeally smart.
Tori Dunlap:
“How old are you?” And so I just went in my free time and then some of the ones you didn’t qualify for, and I was like, “Shoot.” But yeah, it was like… I think I got probably a couple thousand miles.
Tiffany Aliche:
I love that.
Tori Dunlap:
Just like a 22 on my commute, plugging it in my 15-minute train ride.
Tiffany Aliche:
I used to always do studies. I’m like, “Yes, I have sleep apnea for $2000.”
Tori Dunlap:
“You’re going to pay me $2000? Yeah, I have hemorrhoids.” What?
Tiffany Aliche:
Right. What’s the cream again? Exactly.
Tori Dunlap:
Yes, I do have trouble sitting down. It hurts.
Didn’t think I’d ever say the word hemorrhoid on this podcast, but here we are.
All right. I can’t let you go without talking to you about the workbook. And when we say workbook, we do not mean little cute pamphlet. We mean 200 pages full teaching background. It’s on full display here.
So walk us through, first off, what your concept of financial wholeness is. And you might remember if you’ve listened to our previous episodes, but give us a refresh and then talk to us about what does this workbook help you to do.
Tiffany Aliche:
So financial wholeness is which is what the workbook is based off of are these 10 components to your financial life that create the foundation you need for the rest of your financial life.
So that’s budgeting, savings, debt, credit, income, investing, insurance, your financial team, your net worth, and estate planning that if you master these 10 things, there’s nothing you can’t do with your money.
And so when I wrote Get Good With Money, the original book, it was the 10 simple steps of financial wholeness and it did so well, but people were like, “I wish I had a place to do the work alongside of the lesson.” So the teacher in me was like, “Well, why not create a comprehensive workbook?”
Because the Get Good Money is a textbook, a workbook that you can do these 10 steps. So you get to learn the step, you get to see it visually represented, and then you get a space to do the work as you’re learning the step. And so it is just my way of being like, “Let’s really solidify these lessons into your conscious and subconscious so you can change your financial life.”
Tori Dunlap:
And our researcher mentioned this concept of emotional housekeeping that she really loved. Can you define that for us and talk a bit more about it?
Tiffany Aliche:
So when you have… I think that it’s really important that before you start doing tactical work that you have to almost… I call it’s like when you’re seasoning food, you have to season your brain because if you can’t shift your thinking, you’re going to go right back to what you know and then you’re going to go right back to those financial habits.
And so a lot of those things like shame and fear and the judgment you’ve brought with you because you’ve heard people tell you you’re terrible and people who don’t even know you. We follow some folks online and you hear them talk so terribly about people who’ve made financial choices that may not be in their best interest.
Tori Dunlap:
Dave Ramsey.
Tiffany Aliche:
Right.
Tori Dunlap:
I’ll say it. I’ll say it.
Tiffany Aliche:
We call him Voldemort over at Brown Ambition, my podcast.
Tori Dunlap:
Yeah. I just start out all the vowels in his name like it’s a curse word.
Tiffany Aliche:
And so that is not helpful.
And so I thought, “Okay, let’s open up the book with let us release all of that stuff,” because shame shield solutions. So that way when you learn the thing, you’re actually able to not only do it, but stay there and maintain the new tips and tools that I’ve shown you.
Tori Dunlap:
What I love, it’s a one two punch. It’s like, okay, Get Good With Money, Made Whole, it’s like Avengers team together. It’s like Batman and Robin. We’ve got superhero and superhero sidekick, which I think is so impactful.
Tiffany Aliche:
Yes. It’s so surreal. When I went to Barnes & Nobles and to see both of them next to each other, I’m like, “OMG.” And my picture’s on both of them.
Tori Dunlap:
You’re named twice. Yeah.
Tiffany Aliche:
Yeah. It just is so… Although like I said, I put my books on Barnes & Noble over 10 years ago, 15 years ago, thinking one day my book will be here. But it still does feel surreal to see yourself at a Target.
Tori Dunlap:
Yeah, it does.
Tiffany Aliche:
Not just that, but to see myself next to Tori and Jamila and other people in this space that I’m like, “I know these women.”
Tori Dunlap:
Right?
Tiffany Aliche:
You’re looking at this book. I know her.
Tori Dunlap:
Oh, no.
Tiffany Aliche:
She’s here and I’m like, “I’ll be moving all my books to the front.” I’m like, “Girl, bye.”
Tori Dunlap:
Oh, yeah. Literally, I think the first time Vivian, the Rich BFF, I think the first time she saw her book in a store was I called her at Barnes & Noble four days before her release date and I FaceTimed her and I’m like, “Look who it is.” And she’s like, “Wait, I haven’t seen it yet.” And I’m like, “Yeah.” And of course I go to Dave Ramsey’s book and I cover it with hers and I cover it with yours and yeah, it’s so cool.
Tiffany Aliche:
I just love that though. Yeah, there’s this amazing takeover that, no, we actually don’t have to take personal finance the way you’ve been giving it, that we get to have a say in how we receive education in this space.
Tori Dunlap:
Well, and it’s starting to finally look like, one, I want the world to look like, but two, what the world actually does look like, which is Black and brown people and queer people and-
Tiffany Aliche:
Women.
Tori Dunlap:
… women. And it’s just so cool to finally go into the business or finance section and have other options other than fucking Rich Dad, Poor Dad and Dave. Yeah, it’s great.
Thank you as always for being here.
Made Whole is the workbook. Tell us where we can find it as well as how we can connect with you.
Tiffany Aliche:
Well, I am The Budgetnista. I have all the platforms and budgetnista.com. And if you want Made Whole, it’s available at madewholeworkbook.com.
Tori Dunlap:
Amazing. Thank you as always for being here. You’re my favorite person to have back.
Tiffany Aliche:
Well, thank you for having me.
Tori Dunlap:
Thank you, Tiffany, for joining us for this fun TNT Q&A episode. Tiffany’s new workbook Made Whole is out wherever you get your books and makes a perfect companion to her original book, Get Good With Money. You can buy both wherever you get your books.
Thank you as always for being here. We appreciate you sharing the show if it connected with you and subscribing wherever you’re listening right now. And if you want to submit a voicemail for your own question, you can also do so down below and we’ll potentially use it in a future episode. And I may answer your question. So if you have a question about money, about running a business, about paying off debt, about investing, about something else, feel free to leave us a voicemail and we hope to talk to you soon.
Thanks for being here, financial feminists. Have a great ass week. Talk to you later. Bye.
Thank you for listening to Financial Feminist, a Her First 100K podcast. Financial Feminist is hosted by me, Tori Dunlap, produced by Kristen Fields, associate producer Tamisha Grant, researched by Ariel Johnson. Audio and video engineering by Alyssa Medcalf, marketing and operations by Karina Patel, Amanda Leffew, Elizabeth McCumber, Masha Bachmetyeva, Taylor Cho, Kailyn Sprinkle, Sasha Bonnar, Claire Coronan, Daryl Ann Inman, and Jenell Reasoner. Promotional graphics by Mary Stratton, photography by Sarah Wolf, and theme music by Jonah Cohen sound.
A huge thanks to the entire Her First 100K team and community for supporting this show. For more information about Financial Feminist, Her First 100K, our guests and episode show notes, visit financialfeministpodcast.com.
Tori Dunlap
Tori Dunlap is an internationally-recognized money and career expert. After saving $100,000 at age 25, Tori quit her corporate job in marketing and founded Her First $100K to fight financial inequality by giving women actionable resources to better their money. She has helped over one million women negotiate salary, pay off debt, build savings, and invest.
Tori’s work has been featured on Good Morning America, the New York Times, BBC, TIME, PEOPLE, CNN, New York Magazine, Forbes, CNBC, BuzzFeed, and more.
With a dedicated following of almost 250,000 on Instagram and more than 1.6 million on TikTok —and multiple instances of her story going viral—Tori’s unique take on financial advice has made her the go-to voice for ambitious millennial women. CNBC called Tori “the voice of financial confidence for women.”
An honors graduate of the University of Portland, Tori currently lives in Seattle, where she enjoys eating fried chicken, going to barre classes, and attempting to naturally work John Mulaney bits into conversation.
